Crossfire brainfart. Could it work?
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,658
Likes: 4
From: Clifton Park NY
Pro
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 703
Likes: 0
From: Milwaukee Wi
XRam has fuel distribution as well as drivability issues in a cool climate. that plenum never gets warm enough. Design constraints as the plenum floor is like an inch from top plate of plenum. Injector spray is onto plenum floor. Convoluted path from plenum floor to intake port (Z).
I took mine off and replaced with this: Holley Projection dual plane manifold(rated 6500rpms) with GM 454 TB.
[IMG]
[/IMG]
Here is my XRam note plenum depth under TB units.
[/IMG]
I took mine off and replaced with this: Holley Projection dual plane manifold(rated 6500rpms) with GM 454 TB.
[IMG]
[/IMG]Here is my XRam note plenum depth under TB units.
[/IMG]
Last edited by Rohn; Aug 17, 2011 at 04:08 PM.
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,341
Likes: 2
From: Perth Western Australia
St. Jude Donor '10
Thread Starter
Team Owner
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 81,241
Likes: 3,063
From: altered state
St. Jude Donor '05
Agreed, if youre not hung up on the "dual" thing that single TB is less hassle and those intakes work good on 350s. Like a carb setup but not...better.
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,341
Likes: 2
From: Perth Western Australia
St. Jude Donor '10
Looks like a $1000 job (+ freight) though but probably worth it. Changes to fuel lines, throttle cable, inlet ducting and air filter. I presume it would need to be custom fitted.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,232
Likes: 284
I did the single tbi swap years ago, you can reuse the throttle/tv cables, make the cruise control work. Fuel lines are not a big dea & the stock pump will run the tbi. The beauty of it is you can use the stock ecm & harness, its mostly plug & play. Hood clearence can be the issue, you'll have to measure very carefully.
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,341
Likes: 2
From: Perth Western Australia
St. Jude Donor '10
I did the single tbi swap years ago, you can reuse the throttle/tv cables, make the cruise control work. Fuel lines are not a big dea & the stock pump will run the tbi. The beauty of it is you can use the stock ecm & harness, its mostly plug & play. Hood clearence can be the issue, you'll have to measure very carefully.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,765
Likes: 5
If people are doing it then hood clearance can't be a major hurdle. Is there a second hand market for this arrangement or is it a buying brand new proposition? Do both TBI fire at the same time now? Is the single replacement equivalent to the two being replaced in terms of fuel metering? Retuning required?
There has been 2 of those Renegade Intakes for sale in C4 parts in the last 1 week.
I don't know if you caught that or not.
Around $450 or $600.
1 of those Renegade Intakes for sale was In Wheeling, IL.
Also,
another C4 forum member that is on C4 ZR-1 that races his "Z" spoke up on that C4 parts - Renegade for sale.............
He stated the Renegade is really a Wieland intake with a different casted top with the Renegade logo.
Not so special to me that Renegade Intake.
After what you went through................I would not give $ .50 cents for it.
Brian
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Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,765
Likes: 5
Still think the renegade is worlds better than the best worked over crossfire.
Now a worked Renegade, hmm. Too bad you cant get one!
On how far you can go thats hard to say without either going through one or having a sonic tester handy. One day....$$$
Brian thanks for the words, Im just a backyarder though. Appreciate it.
Those runners are long enough I wouldnt worry about airspeed or puddling, most that is old school thinking from the 60s of guys overjetting their Holleys and fouling plugs. Thats where the advantage of EFI/TBI comes into play bet you could polish them like mirrors and it will run the same as if they were rough. Just an opinion thats all.
Now a worked Renegade, hmm. Too bad you cant get one!
On how far you can go thats hard to say without either going through one or having a sonic tester handy. One day....$$$
Brian thanks for the words, Im just a backyarder though. Appreciate it.
Those runners are long enough I wouldnt worry about airspeed or puddling, most that is old school thinking from the 60s of guys overjetting their Holleys and fouling plugs. Thats where the advantage of EFI/TBI comes into play bet you could polish them like mirrors and it will run the same as if they were rough. Just an opinion thats all.
I have been to every racing shop in Illinois 1 time or another.
Seen the head porting work they have done.
I have been to INDY Head Racing Service in Indianapolis, Indiana.
The owner Russ showed me around & wooed me with his own porting workmanship.
From the photos you shared on C4 in the past>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
YOU ARE BETTER & DO MUCH CLEANER PORTING WORK.
I can make my own calls.
You are better than most out there porting Intakes & Cylinder Heads.
Brian R.
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,341
Likes: 2
From: Perth Western Australia
St. Jude Donor '10
Steve,
There has been 2 of those Renegade Intakes for sale in C4 parts in the last 1 week.
I don't know if you caught that or not.
Around $450 or $600.
1 of those Renegade Intakes for sale was In Wheeling, IL.
Also,
another C4 forum member that is on C4 ZR-1 that races his "Z" spoke up on that C4 parts - Renegade for sale.............
He stated the Renegade is really a Wieland intake with a different casted top with the Renegade logo.
Not so special to me that Renegade Intake.
After what you went through................I would not give $ .50 cents for it.
Brian
There has been 2 of those Renegade Intakes for sale in C4 parts in the last 1 week.
I don't know if you caught that or not.
Around $450 or $600.
1 of those Renegade Intakes for sale was In Wheeling, IL.
Also,
another C4 forum member that is on C4 ZR-1 that races his "Z" spoke up on that C4 parts - Renegade for sale.............
He stated the Renegade is really a Wieland intake with a different casted top with the Renegade logo.
Not so special to me that Renegade Intake.
After what you went through................I would not give $ .50 cents for it.
Brian
Last edited by Lemme; Aug 19, 2011 at 09:10 PM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,765
Likes: 5
It is a Weiland Intake Design & Product.
That guy made his own adapter top with his Renegade Logo.
He fooled the entire C4 world................................... .................
And even my buddie in Australia>>>You Steve.
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,341
Likes: 2
From: Perth Western Australia
St. Jude Donor '10
I am quite interested in the single tb idea with the dual plane mainfold. Would it be also be possible or worthwhile putting my L98 128 heads on the L83? 76cc iron heads to 58cc aluminium heads: 9:1 to 11:1 cr may be too high I think? My heads have been milled so may be only 54cc. Have to change the cam to lower the dynamic compression ratio.
Last edited by Lemme; Aug 18, 2011 at 07:29 PM.
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,341
Likes: 2
From: Perth Western Australia
St. Jude Donor '10
Melting Slicks
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,232
Likes: 284
Ok, the intake I used was the Holley 300-49, it included a tbi gasket, egr hardware & block off plate, throttle/tv cable brackets, & intake bolts.
The tbi that I used was the Holley 502-6, it has 2" bores & a adjustable fuel pressure regulator. Or you can use a tbi from a 87-89 Chevy truck w/ the 5.7L motor. This tbi has smaller bores the the Holley, but the price is much more reasonable (junkyards/swap meets).
Some guys have used the GM 454 tbi unit, it has a different iac connector & some did not have a tv cable connection on the throttle arm.
To make the fuel lines, remove the fittings from the cfi tbi units & put them on the single tbi. These lines are 3/8 & 5/16, they used a double flare (atleast on my 84). I went w/ the fittings from the newer tbi units, this is a flare w/ a o-ring. Use Dorman 800-153 & 800-151, sold at all the chain stores.
Like I said the air cleaner will need to be carefully measured, I had to trim a K&N element to clear, you can see the picture of my engine in my avatar. Those carb hats may work good too, Spectre has a new one that looks cool, Spectre 865-728.
The tbi that I used was the Holley 502-6, it has 2" bores & a adjustable fuel pressure regulator. Or you can use a tbi from a 87-89 Chevy truck w/ the 5.7L motor. This tbi has smaller bores the the Holley, but the price is much more reasonable (junkyards/swap meets).
Some guys have used the GM 454 tbi unit, it has a different iac connector & some did not have a tv cable connection on the throttle arm.
To make the fuel lines, remove the fittings from the cfi tbi units & put them on the single tbi. These lines are 3/8 & 5/16, they used a double flare (atleast on my 84). I went w/ the fittings from the newer tbi units, this is a flare w/ a o-ring. Use Dorman 800-153 & 800-151, sold at all the chain stores.
Like I said the air cleaner will need to be carefully measured, I had to trim a K&N element to clear, you can see the picture of my engine in my avatar. Those carb hats may work good too, Spectre has a new one that looks cool, Spectre 865-728.
Racer
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 261
Likes: 0
From: Spokane WA
There is NO CASTING FOUNDRY STEVE,
It is a Weiland Intake Design & Product.
That guy made his own adapter top with his Renegade Logo.
He fooled the entire C4 world................................... .................
And even my buddie in Australia>>>You Steve.
It is a Weiland Intake Design & Product.
That guy made his own adapter top with his Renegade Logo.
He fooled the entire C4 world................................... .................
And even my buddie in Australia>>>You Steve.
Racer
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 261
Likes: 0
From: Spokane WA
If you are looking for an X-ram I could hook you up. I have one at home on the shelf. It is the latest version, the first 3 versions of the x-ram were not so good. The one I have is version 4.
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,341
Likes: 2
From: Perth Western Australia
St. Jude Donor '10
Ok, the intake I used was the Holley 300-49, it included a tbi gasket, egr hardware & block off plate, throttle/tv cable brackets, & intake bolts.
The tbi that I used was the Holley 502-6, it has 2" bores & a adjustable fuel pressure regulator. Or you can use a tbi from a 87-89 Chevy truck w/ the 5.7L motor. This tbi has smaller bores the the Holley, but the price is much more reasonable (junkyards/swap meets).
Some guys have used the GM 454 tbi unit, it has a different iac connector & some did not have a tv cable connection on the throttle arm.
To make the fuel lines, remove the fittings from the cfi tbi units & put them on the single tbi. These lines are 3/8 & 5/16, they used a double flare (atleast on my 84). I went w/ the fittings from the newer tbi units, this is a flare w/ a o-ring. Use Dorman 800-153 & 800-151, sold at all the chain stores.
Like I said the air cleaner will need to be carefully measured, I had to trim a K&N element to clear, you can see the picture of my engine in my avatar. Those carb hats may work good too, Spectre has a new one that looks cool, Spectre 865-728.
The tbi that I used was the Holley 502-6, it has 2" bores & a adjustable fuel pressure regulator. Or you can use a tbi from a 87-89 Chevy truck w/ the 5.7L motor. This tbi has smaller bores the the Holley, but the price is much more reasonable (junkyards/swap meets).
Some guys have used the GM 454 tbi unit, it has a different iac connector & some did not have a tv cable connection on the throttle arm.
To make the fuel lines, remove the fittings from the cfi tbi units & put them on the single tbi. These lines are 3/8 & 5/16, they used a double flare (atleast on my 84). I went w/ the fittings from the newer tbi units, this is a flare w/ a o-ring. Use Dorman 800-153 & 800-151, sold at all the chain stores.
Like I said the air cleaner will need to be carefully measured, I had to trim a K&N element to clear, you can see the picture of my engine in my avatar. Those carb hats may work good too, Spectre has a new one that looks cool, Spectre 865-728.