Code 36 help
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 400
Likes: 5
From: Bakersfield Ca
hmmmmmm
partially answering my own question...
The Fuel Pump relay only stays on approx for 1 sec after the ignition is turned off......
any clues as to what parameter I should be looking at to confirm ECM is actually seeing them and staying on for the required time..
I need to confirm what Cliff said:
The ECM waits 5 seconds after ignition-off to start the MAF burnoff. The burnoff lasts 1 second. The ECM shuts down 11.3 seconds after ignition-off. The burnoff test starts 0.3 seconds after burnoff starts. The ECM make 6 voltage measurements and all 6 must be within the voltage window to pass the error code 36 test.
partially answering my own question...
The Fuel Pump relay only stays on approx for 1 sec after the ignition is turned off......
any clues as to what parameter I should be looking at to confirm ECM is actually seeing them and staying on for the required time..
I need to confirm what Cliff said:
The ECM waits 5 seconds after ignition-off to start the MAF burnoff. The burnoff lasts 1 second. The ECM shuts down 11.3 seconds after ignition-off. The burnoff test starts 0.3 seconds after burnoff starts. The ECM make 6 voltage measurements and all 6 must be within the voltage window to pass the error code 36 test.
Monday I will be having angioplasty and out of it. I hope I can pass your info on.
The ECM make 6 voltage measurements and all 6 must be within the voltage window to pass the error code 36 test
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 400
Likes: 5
From: Bakersfield Ca
Where did you find
The ECM make 6 voltage measurements and all 6 must be within the voltage window to pass the error code 36 test
the info on the codes and the ECM parameters test.. What are the other five. I probably know the answer but doubt myself.
Thanks Steve
The ECM make 6 voltage measurements and all 6 must be within the voltage window to pass the error code 36 test
the info on the codes and the ECM parameters test.. What are the other five. I probably know the answer but doubt myself.
Thanks Steve
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 10,036
Likes: 346
From: Anaheim CA
Code:
;--------------------------------------------------------
; Error 36 Params
; >> MAF Burnoff diagnostics <<
;--------------------------------------------------------
LC221: FCB 3 ; 0.3 Second delay prior to burnoff voltage test, CAL = Arg * 10
LC222: FCB 6 ; 6 fails required to set Error 36
LC223: FCB 95 ; Fail burnoff test if ADC > 1.90 VDC
LC224: FCB 20 ; Fail burnoff test if ADC < 400 mVDC
Last edited by Cliff Harris; Feb 9, 2015 at 11:55 PM.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 400
Likes: 5
From: Bakersfield Ca
It's in the program code in the ECM:
Looking at this again, it looks like it could fail some of the test and still not set an error code 36.
Code:
;--------------------------------------------------------
; Error 36 Params
; >> MAF Burnoff diagnostics <<
;--------------------------------------------------------
LC221: FCB 3 ; 0.3 Second delay prior to burnoff voltage test, CAL = Arg * 10
LC222: FCB 6 ; 6 fails required to set Error 36
LC223: FCB 95 ; Fail burnoff test if ADC > 1.90 VDC
LC224: FCB 20 ; Fail burnoff test if ADC < 400 mVDC
Will pass info on to shop later today
6am I will be in for angioplasty.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 400
Likes: 5
From: Bakersfield Ca
I think you were right on with your voltage test thanks. John is still putting vet back together. He may finish tomorrow.
thanks
steve
Last edited by AJ123; Feb 13, 2015 at 09:06 PM.
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 10,036
Likes: 346
From: Anaheim CA
The cold start injector was eliminated in 1989 and the startup fuel calibration was changed to account for that. You might run very rich at startup, but that won't hurt anything once the engine is running.
You could disconnect the cold start injector...
You could disconnect the cold start injector...
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 400
Likes: 5
From: Bakersfield Ca
Got rid of the 9th injector when we installed the Super Ram.
I wasn't there when they started her up but running rich at start up is what they mentioned.
Thanks again for everyone's help,
Racer
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 367
Likes: 7
From: Congupna Victoria
Well looks like your info helped Cliff, The voltage that was being read by the computer was 3.?. I believe John said it had to be 1.7. So the MAF sensor was the third one I have put on this project all were a1Cardone. John had autozone deliver one this morning and the ecm stop sending code 36. We also installed an 89 ecm 16198259 and an 89 prom.
I think you were right on with your voltage test thanks. John is still putting vet back together. He may finish tomorrow.
thanks
steve
I think you were right on with your voltage test thanks. John is still putting vet back together. He may finish tomorrow.
thanks
steve
HOw did he measure the voltage at the ECM?
What was the problem?
Was the fix a replacement MAF?
Thanks
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Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 400
Likes: 5
From: Bakersfield Ca
We also replaced the ECM and prom from an 89 corvette at the same time.
Every wire and circuit has been checked or replaced.
He explained just because you see the wire glow it visually can't tell you the voltage.
When I see him Monday I will ask him exactly how he measured the voltage unless Cliff knows how it can be done. The vehicle is still at the shop he is installing a new clutch pedal safety switch. I had surgery Monday and I can't drive it yet. Still on pain meds
Racer
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 367
Likes: 7
From: Congupna Victoria
Steve,
Thanks,
Keen to know how he got a result.
I'm using datamaster to try to see the voltage, but no luck.....something screwy is going on (see above posts)
The Datamaster can't see the voltage from the maf.....just goes to 23g/sec.....don't know what dcvolts that is.....
What brand maf did you finally go with?
Thanks,
Keen to know how he got a result.
I'm using datamaster to try to see the voltage, but no luck.....something screwy is going on (see above posts)
The Datamaster can't see the voltage from the maf.....just goes to 23g/sec.....don't know what dcvolts that is.....
What brand maf did you finally go with?
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 400
Likes: 5
From: Bakersfield Ca
Steve,
Thanks,
Keen to know how he got a result.
I'm using datamaster to try to see the voltage, but no luck.....something screwy is going on (see above posts)
The Datamaster can't see the voltage from the maf.....just goes to 23g/sec.....don't know what dcvolts that is.....
What brand maf did you finally go with?
Thanks,
Keen to know how he got a result.
I'm using datamaster to try to see the voltage, but no luck.....something screwy is going on (see above posts)
The Datamaster can't see the voltage from the maf.....just goes to 23g/sec.....don't know what dcvolts that is.....
What brand maf did you finally go with?
Last edited by AJ123; Feb 15, 2015 at 01:03 AM.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 400
Likes: 5
From: Bakersfield Ca
By Cliff Harris this is were john found the answer. John spliced into the green wire from at the ecm. He said that you wait for closed loop turn off engine voltage should be 2 volts when signal for burn off goes through the voltage should drop to (400mVDC to 1.90VDC in your car). If the output is outside those higher or lower code 36 will occur. My MAF showed 3.4 volts John decided we try another maf sensor. The new one read 1.70VDC. For now after trying everything in the book Cliff Had the answer.
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...ay-issues.html
"MAF burnoff is done when the ignition is turned off. The ECM stays alive for about 10 seconds to do the MAF burnoff and to reset the IAC. The ECM must be in closed loop mode when the ignition is turned off for MAF burnoff to occur.
The MAF burnoff relay applies 12 volts to the MAF sensor wire. That causes it to glow red and burn off any deposits that may have accumulated. During the burnoff cycle the ECM looks for the MAF output voltage to be between programmed values (400mVDC to 1.90VDC in my car). If the output is outside those values then it will set error code 36.
If the burnoff relay is bad then burnoff will not happen. Over time the MAF output will deteriorate and the engine will not run properly"
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...ay-issues.html
"MAF burnoff is done when the ignition is turned off. The ECM stays alive for about 10 seconds to do the MAF burnoff and to reset the IAC. The ECM must be in closed loop mode when the ignition is turned off for MAF burnoff to occur.
The MAF burnoff relay applies 12 volts to the MAF sensor wire. That causes it to glow red and burn off any deposits that may have accumulated. During the burnoff cycle the ECM looks for the MAF output voltage to be between programmed values (400mVDC to 1.90VDC in my car). If the output is outside those values then it will set error code 36.
If the burnoff relay is bad then burnoff will not happen. Over time the MAF output will deteriorate and the engine will not run properly"
Racer
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 367
Likes: 7
From: Congupna Victoria
Steve,
good to hear the measurement was successful.
How did he measure the voltage coming out of the green wire?
Did he use a voltmeter or a CRO?
By changing the MAF, it seems as though you're getting the right voltages......have you confirmed no more Code 36?
Cliff,
Do you have (or can find) the conversion chart for the MAF from g/sec to volts?
Thanks
good to hear the measurement was successful.
How did he measure the voltage coming out of the green wire?
Did he use a voltmeter or a CRO?
By changing the MAF, it seems as though you're getting the right voltages......have you confirmed no more Code 36?
Cliff,
Do you have (or can find) the conversion chart for the MAF from g/sec to volts?
Thanks
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 400
Likes: 5
From: Bakersfield Ca
Steve,
good to hear the measurement was successful.
How did he measure the voltage coming out of the green wire?
Did he use a voltmeter or a CRO?
By changing the MAF, it seems as though you're getting the right voltages......have you confirmed no more Code 36?
Cliff,
Do you have (or can find) the conversion chart for the MAF from g/sec to volts?
Thanks
good to hear the measurement was successful.
How did he measure the voltage coming out of the green wire?
Did he use a voltmeter or a CRO?
By changing the MAF, it seems as though you're getting the right voltages......have you confirmed no more Code 36?
Cliff,
Do you have (or can find) the conversion chart for the MAF from g/sec to volts?
Thanks
Volt meter
shop is busy so when they put the new clutch safety switch in I will get her back.
I will let you know it the fix works in another week or so
Steve
Racer
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 367
Likes: 7
From: Congupna Victoria
[QUOTE=AJ123;1588977422]Volt meter
shop is busy so when they put the new clutch safety switch in I will get her back.
[QUOTE]
Do you know if it was a digital or analogue volt meter?
Hope you're feeling better.
shop is busy so when they put the new clutch safety switch in I will get her back.
[QUOTE]
Do you know if it was a digital or analogue volt meter?
Hope you're feeling better.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 400
Likes: 5
From: Bakersfield Ca
[QUOTE=puzzigully;1588985634][QUOTE=AJ123;1588977422]Volt meter
shop is busy so when they put the new clutch safety switch in I will get her back.
I believe he used a digital
When I see him I will ask so I don't give you boas info
shop is busy so when they put the new clutch safety switch in I will get her back.
Do you know if it was a digital or analogue volt meter?
Hope you're feeling better.
Hope you're feeling better.
When I see him I will ask so I don't give you boas info
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 10,036
Likes: 346
From: Anaheim CA
Code:
;---------------------------------------- ; gm/sec BIN VDC lb/hr ;---------------------------------------- ; 0.0 0 0.00 0 ; 3.2 64 0.18 25 ; 4.5 128 0.37 35 ; 6.2 192 0.55 48 ; 8.4 256 0.73 65 ; 10.9 320 0.91 84 ; 14.0 384 1.10 108 ; 17.7 448 1.28 137 ; 22.3 512 1.46 172 ; 22.3 512 1.46 172 ; 25.0 544 1.55 193 ; 27.6 576 1.65 213 ; 30.6 608 1.74 236 ; 33.8 640 1.83 264 ; 37.1 672 1.92 287 ; 40.7 704 2.01 314 ; 44.5 736 2.10 343 ; 47.7 768 2.19 368 ; 47.7 768 2.19 368 ; 51.2 800 2.29 395 ; 55.1 832 2.38 425 ; 59.0 864 2.47 455 ; 63.2 896 2.56 488 ; 67.8 928 2.65 523 ; 72.3 960 2.74 558 ; 77.2 992 2.83 596 ; 82.0 1024 2.93 633 ; 82.3 1024 2.93 635 ; 87.5 1056 3.02 676 ; 92.8 1088 3.11 716 ; 98.6 1120 3.20 761 ; 104.4 1152 3.29 806 ; 110.7 1184 3.38 855 ; 117.1 1216 3.47 903 ; 125.0 1248 3.57 965 ; 134.5 1280 3.66 1038 ; 134.2 1280 3.66 1036 ; 142.3 1312 3.75 1098 ; 150.4 1344 3.84 1161 ; 158.5 1376 3.93 1223 ; 167.4 1408 4.02 1292 ; 177.1 1440 4.11 1367 ; 186.0 1472 4.21 1435 ; 195.7 1504 4.30 1510 ; 206.2 1536 4.39 1591 ; 206.2 1536 4.39 1591 ; 212.2 1552 4.43 1637 ; 218.1 1568 4.48 1684 ; 225.1 1584 4.53 1737 ; 232.1 1600 4.57 1791 ; 239.1 1616 4.62 1845 ; 247.0 1632 4.66 1906 ; 254.0 1648 4.71 1960 ; 254.0 1664 4.75 1960 ; 254.0 1680 4.80 1960 ; 254.0 1696 4.85 1960 ; 254.0 1712 4.89 1960 ; 254.0 1728 4.94 1960 ; 254.0 1744 4.98 1960 ; 254.0 1760 5.03 1960 ; 254.0 1776 5.07 1960 ; 254.0 1792 5.12 1960
Racer
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 367
Likes: 7
From: Congupna Victoria
Thanks Cliff,
Going off that data, the ECM must be "seeing" around the 1.56-1.5V based on the "23" figure I'm seeing.
Still what is disturbing is the fact the Data collection does not show the MAF Burn Off "event", even though it is happening???
Steve's mechanic seemed to "see" the Burn off take place with a digital Voltmeter and get a reading...
I will have to try again to tap into the C terminal on the MAF and observe the output.
I did buy some CRC MAF cleaner and will give it a spray on the weekend and see if that works at all....
Any other advice?
Going off that data, the ECM must be "seeing" around the 1.56-1.5V based on the "23" figure I'm seeing.
Still what is disturbing is the fact the Data collection does not show the MAF Burn Off "event", even though it is happening???
Steve's mechanic seemed to "see" the Burn off take place with a digital Voltmeter and get a reading...
I will have to try again to tap into the C terminal on the MAF and observe the output.
I did buy some CRC MAF cleaner and will give it a spray on the weekend and see if that works at all....
Any other advice?
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 400
Likes: 5
From: Bakersfield Ca
Thanks Cliff,
Going off that data, the ECM must be "seeing" around the 1.56-1.5V based on the "23" figure I'm seeing.
Still what is disturbing is the fact the Data collection does not show the MAF Burn Off "event", even though it is happening???
Steve's mechanic seemed to "see" the Burn off take place with a digital Voltmeter and get a reading...
I will have to try again to tap into the C terminal on the MAF and observe the output.
I did buy some CRC MAF cleaner and will give it a spray on the weekend and see if that works at all....
Any other advice?
Going off that data, the ECM must be "seeing" around the 1.56-1.5V based on the "23" figure I'm seeing.
Still what is disturbing is the fact the Data collection does not show the MAF Burn Off "event", even though it is happening???
Steve's mechanic seemed to "see" the Burn off take place with a digital Voltmeter and get a reading...
I will have to try again to tap into the C terminal on the MAF and observe the output.
I did buy some CRC MAF cleaner and will give it a spray on the weekend and see if that works at all....
Any other advice?
Good luck
Steve
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 10,036
Likes: 346
From: Anaheim CA
Just picked up vet. Warning. He said using an analog volt meter could burn up ECM. Make sure it is digital. He also added the reason he spliced into the green wire at the ECM was because of all the bad wiring we had been replacing. You can also check from the green wire at the MAF plug.
Good luck
Steve
Good luck
Steve
I bought some decorative pins at Walmart (about 20 in the package) and used one for my MAF testing:
