That's comical......not for you of course...because you'll be the one having problems. The service manual is specific about this bolt, and in no way condones it being reused.....specifically..because of the type of bolt it is. This has been proven time and time again, by forum members hoping to save themselves a few bucks on a new bolt, and end up pulling the car apart...because the bolt comes loose...balancer walks, etc.

Since he did not feel it necessary to replace the bolt, I doubt he followed the recommended torque specs, which will end up causing issues as well.

The reality is, it was no skin off his nose to buy the bolt, and do the job correctly; however, he chose not to.

Good luck with that.....

 

Well, your mechanic is wrong on this. Ask him to give you the name of his "GM guy" and pm it to me. I would love to talk with him. The harmonic damper to crankshaft bolt is a one time use for good reason. You have a high risk of problems down the road with the old bolt being reused. Without proper torque there is a chance that the damper could spin on the noise of the crank causing enough damage that the crankshaft might have to be replaced.

 

This is the procedure directly out of the GM C5 Service Manual. Tell your GM Expert that he full of CRAP!

This is a quote from one of the very first paragraphs in the removal procedure:

"
Do not use the crankshaft balancer bolt again. Install a NEW crankshaft balancer bolt during final assembly."

Yea,,,,were picky. So is the service manual.

Notice
Use the correct fastener in the correct location. Replacement fasteners must be the correct part number for that application. Fasteners requiring replacement or fasteners requiring the use of thread locking compound or sealant are identified in the service procedure. Do not use paints, lubricants, or corrosion inhibitors on fasteners or fastener joint surfaces unless specified. These coatings affect fastener torque and joint clamping force and may damage the fastener. Use the correct tightening sequence and specifications when installing fasteners in order to avoid damage to parts and systems.



Important
For manual transmission applications, note the position of the crankshaft balancer before removal. The balancer does not use a key or keyway for positioning. Mark or scribe the end of the crankshaft and the balancer before component removal. The crankshaft balancer must be installed to the original position. If replacing the crankshaft balancer, note the location of any existing balance weights, if applicable. Install new balance weights into the new crankshaft balancer, if applicable. Crankshaft balancer weights must be installed into the new balancer in the same location as the old balancer. A properly installed balance weight will be either flush or below flush with the face of the balancer.
Do not use the crankshaft balancer bolt again. Install a NEW crankshaft balancer bolt during final assembly.
Make sure that the teeth of the flywheel holding tool mesh with the teeth of the engine flywheel.

Install the J 42386-A and bolts. Use one M10-1.5 x 120 mm and one M10-1.5 x 45 mm bolt for proper tool operation. Tighten
Tighten the J 42386-A bolts to 50 N·m (37 lb ft).





Remove the crankshaft balancer bolt. Do not discard the crankshaft balancer bolt. The balancer bolt will be used during the balancer installation procedure.



Mark or scribe the crankshaft balancer and the end of the crankshaft. Note the balancer installed position on the crankshaft for assembly. Refer to Engine Balancing .



Use the J 41816 and the J 41816-2 in order to remove the crankshaft balancer.
Remove the J 42386-A and bolts.



Note the position of crankshaft balancer weights, if applicable.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Document ID# 372647
1999 Chevrolet/Geo Corvette

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Crankshaft Balancer Replacement
Removal Procedure





Caution
Before servicing any electrical component, the ignition key must be in the OFF or LOCK position and all electrical loads must be OFF, unless instructed otherwise in these procedures. If a tool or equipment could easily come in contact with a live exposed electrical terminal, also disconnect the negative battery cable. Failure to follow these precautions may cause personal injury and/or damage to the vehicle or its components.


Disconnect the negative battery cable.
Release the accessory drive belt tensioner (3).
Remove the drive belt (5) from the engine.
Remove and reposition the electronic brake control module from the bracket. Refer to Electronic Brake Control Module (EBCM) Replacement in ABS.
Remove the power steering gear from the vehicle. Refer to Power Steering Gear Replacement in Power Steering System.
Remove the starter motor. Refer to Starter Motor Replacement in Engine Electrical.



Remove the power steering cooler bolts from the front crossmember.
Remove the power steering cooler from the front crossmember and reposition.



Release the air conditioning (A/C) belt tensioner (10).
Remove the A/C drive belt (1) from the engine.
Remove the crankshaft balancer. Refer to Crankshaft Balancer Removal and Engine Balancing .
Installation Procedure




Install the crankshaft balancer. Refer to Crankshaft Balancer Installation and Engine Balancing .
Install the A/C drive belt (1) to the engine.
Install the power steering gear. Refer to Power Steering Gear Replacement in Power Steering System.



Install the power steering cooler to the front crossmember.

Notice
Use the correct fastener in the correct location. Replacement fasteners must be the correct part number for that application. Fasteners requiring replacement or fasteners requiring the use of thread locking compound or sealant are identified in the service procedure. Do not use paints, lubricants, or corrosion inhibitors on fasteners or fastener joint surfaces unless specified. These coatings affect fastener torque and joint clamping force and may damage the fastener. Use the correct tightening sequence and specifications when installing fasteners in order to avoid damage to parts and systems.


Install the power steering cooler bolts. Tighten
Tighten the power steering cooler bolts to 11 N·m (97 lb in).

Install the starter motor. Refer to Starter Motor Replacement in Engine Electrical.
Lower the vehicle.



Install the accessory drive belt (5) to the engine.
Install the electronic brake control module to the bracket. Refer to Electronic Brake Control Module (EBCM) Replacement in ABS.
Connect the negative battery cable. Tighten
Tighten the negative battery cable bolt to 15 N·m (11 lb ft).

Program the Transmitters. Refer to Transmitter Programming/Synchronization in Keyless Entry.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Document ID# 424837
1999 Chevrolet/Geo Corvette

 

Your mechanic and his GM guy are both wrong. Has nothing to do with being a fanatic. What a moron.

 

Regarding this portion of the instructions:

I am replacing my stock balancer with a Powerbond UD unit. My stock balancer (manual transmission car) has one balance weight in it. The Powerbond balancer does not have any holes in it to transfer the weight to. What should I do, just leave the weight out?

 

Do not install a weight on the Powerbond, just install it as it came out of the box. The LS1 in internally balanced.

 

Tell your GM Expert that he full of CRAP!


Could not have said it better Mr. Bill Curlee!!

 

Wrong advice to just install it as it came. IMO

If your balancer has a weight the best choice would be to very carefully mark the weight location to the nose of the crankshaft before removing the original balancer. Once the balancer is removed take both the old and the new to a machine shop and have them match the old to new. This can be done by drilling the new balancer 180 deg's out from where the weight is on the old. Then carefully install the new balancer with the weight at the same crankshaft location as the old.

The LS engines are internally balanced, but the added weights are to correct for engines that are slightly off internally. Corvettes are more sensitive to imbalance compared to other vehicles requiring tighter tolerances.

To do nothing but install the Powerbond as it comes may cause an unacceptable amount of vibration.

 

Hi Eric,
The LS1 is internally balanced as Chris stated, the weight on the balancer was to balance the balancer itself IMO. The new balancer is also zero balanced from the factory, so you would want to install it as it comes out of the box.
We have installed countless amounts of balancers this way and never had an issue. Plus it would open the door for way to many vibration issues if the techs had to be so precise.

 

Doug, Still bad advice.

Quote from the manual:
Important: For manual transmission applications, note the position of the crankshaft balancer before removal. The balancer does not use a key or keyway for positioning. Mark or scribe the end of the crankshaft and the balancer before removal. If replacing the crankshaft balancer, note the location of any existing balance weights (if applicable). Install new balance weights into the new crankshaft balancer (if applicable) in the same location as the old balancer. A properly installed balance weight will be either flush or below flush with the face of the balancer.

The weights in the balancer are to correct the engine, not the balancer. The balancer comes net zero and corrections are made by drilling, not adding weights. Again, the weight is to correct the engine.

 

Well,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,I installed the Powerbond dampner on my 02 ZO6. My OEM damper had holes drilled all over it but I did not see any pins. I just installed the Powerbond as it comes out of the box and have NOT had any additional vibrations or issues. Excellent product for a decient price.

 

If your harmonic balancer has no weights, than you can just bolt the new one up. The issue is if there are added weights in the original unit they need to be tranfered or accounted for. These added weights are there to correct engine internal imbalance. They are added at the end of the engine assembly line during hot testing of the engine.

 

So here's a thought. Obviously, aftermarket balancers come in different flavors i.e 10%, 25% underdrive....and overdrive. This leads me to believe due to different configurations, materials, etc... there must be a disparity in mass and weight. Since the factory balancers are all made of the same material, and dimensionally the same; thus, the mass should be the same. I'm wondering what the aftermarket balancer manufacturers are observing besides the basic dimensions? It is obvious that all are not created equal, and while most are used with success, at least one balancer has been associcated with timing chain failure.....makes me wonder what the intrinsic difference is.

 

Reading, or years of experience and 1000's of installs, you decide.

 

I wouldnt think it would matter based on what lucky131969 proposed. That makes perfect sense. The balancers from PB are UD and different sized so the weight would have no effect or a negative effect. If I go out and replace my 18" wheels with 15" wheels it wouldnt do me any good to put the weights in the same place as the 18" wheel would it? Your info is from a factory manual and Im sure the intention is to replace with OEM parts. Then I would agree with your statement in that respect.

 

Doug, I guess I need you to explain this comment as I'm not sure what you mean.

 

Lucky, the point that most folks seem to be missing, we are not balancing the harmonic balancer. The mass is needed to correct the rotating group in the engine. If I have an inch ounce of imbalance I can correct it a number of ways. I can use a weight of 1 oz at a 1 inch radius or I can use 1/2 oz at 2 inch radius. The diameter of the balancer doesn't matter as long I as end up with the right amount of weight at a radius that = the amount of imbalance.

 

I understand what you are saying. The one caveat from the service manual, is that the transfer of balancer weights only applies to a manual transmission, and not an auto. This would suggest the additional weight is compensating for the clutch/flywheel assembly.

Anyone you can speak to at work that could nail this down? In particular, I'd like to know what method they use after assembly of an engine (intended for a manual trans) to determine how much weight should be added to the balancer.

 

Check PM.

 

First let me apologize to slopoke17 for hijacking your thread... didn't think it would be so involved

And thanks to all of you for your help! Just some more background. I took a picture of the balancers so every one else following this thread has a clear idea of what's going on:



You can see the balance wheight as the white dot in the stock balancer on the left. It's a small "slug" pressed into the outer ring at about 12 o'clock in the photo. The balancer on the right is my new Powerbond 10% UD. As you can see, there is not much room to drill a hole in the outer ring of the Powerbond pulley, and a hole any more than about 1/8 inch deep will break into the grooves for the serpentine belt (probably not good for the belt)



At this point, I think I'm going to proceed with installing the PB balancer "as is".

Thanks again.

Paul