Cats delete
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 6,993
Likes: 25
There's no free lunch with an underdrive pully-to me it's a waste of time for the tiny gain you might get. Some of you guys will spend all kinds of money and HACK your car up for 2 hp-WHY? There are less Redneck ways to get HP that keep your car intact. These hack jobs make the car harder to service and sell, especially if you try to sell to someone in a state that does have emission inspections not to mention trying to fugure out what you did when the car gets sick.The argument of "I don't care about the air" is ridiculous-maybe the guys using this as an excuse should run their tailpipes directly into the cabin-they can get all the "Smell" they like for the few minutes it will last till it all over for them.
Pro
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 585
Likes: 2
I'm just surprised that no one has yet brought up the fact that cats are there for a very good reason. They help keep the air that we and our children breath, clean. Don't get me wrong, I am far from being a "tree-hugger" or I would be driving something like a Prius or Smart. But come on, is it worth polluting the air for a slight (mostly perceived) horsepower gain? Seriously though, is it really that important whether or not there's smog testing in the particular state (or province) that you live in? Don't you want to at least try to do your part. These cars were designed to make a lot of clean horsepower while keeping emissions low and fuel mileage up. It was quite an achievement. Don't you think?
Comments like these are nice to read on the Corvette Forum. As a community we should all be demonstrating that we can enjoy our performance cars while still caring about the world around us. I don't understand the Bubba-minded mentality of some owners. My Corvettes (C3s and C5s) are exempt from emissions testing, yet all of them are performing well above factory specs with their catalytic converters still in place.
I've been saying for a while around here that I wish more car enthusiasts would do their part to help reduce pollution. Sacrificing our environment and the future health of our children for a one or two horsepower gain on an already stupidly fast car is just plain selfish.
LO PHAT
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 18,048
Likes: 53
From: long Island NY
Its one thing if your cats are shot and you needed to spend a small fortune for new ones, at that point delete them if you want. But to pull them off, there will be real no seat in the pants feeling just a bit louder. If we were going to discuss a 78' vette yeah thats a different story cat technology sucked. You have to bet manufactures know where the power loss is intake/exhaust so the cats that are being put on these cars are not killing power by any real measureable degree.
Racer
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 322
Likes: 0
I forgot that for most of you "modifying" your car means putting chrome on your alternator and deciding what brand of car wax to use.
For a stock car you won't see drastic increases.
Modified cars, heads cam, stroker, forced induction you will obviously see much higher gains.
But to say you're not going to gain anything and that removing them will lower gas mileage is pure ignorance.
Also keep in mind any mods you do to a car will benefit from a professional tune.
Buy a Prius and go hug a tree.
For a stock car you won't see drastic increases.
Modified cars, heads cam, stroker, forced induction you will obviously see much higher gains.
But to say you're not going to gain anything and that removing them will lower gas mileage is pure ignorance.
Also keep in mind any mods you do to a car will benefit from a professional tune.
Buy a Prius and go hug a tree.
Race Director
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 11,060
Likes: 291
From: Pasco WA
Hmm, I changed the pulley and now,
Car temp creeps up in traffic or when idling a lot.
Voltage slowly drops in traffic or when idling a lot.
Power steering doesn't work quite as well at idle. A slight rev of the engine and the wheel is much easier to turn.
So don't be so arrogant to tell me what I experience is BS. Maybe it works for your typical driving but I noticed a change in all 3 since installing the pulley. If I'm in traffic and the temps are climbing and the voltage is dropping I can drive in 1st at 1000rpm or even just hold 1000rpm while stopped and the car will respond positively so it's definately the accessory speed. I had to turn off the AC in a big traffic jamb one evening when it was maybe 80F out to keep the car from over heating - and I don't mean the stock hi fan temps either, it hit 245F and was still climbing. I had no-where to turn for a stretch and nothing was moving. If the AC didn't work then the next step was pulling over. I had no problems with the car running hot like that before the U/D pulley. We don't get hot days like in Texas either so I don't want to see the O/P who lives in Texas go into this blindly.
Seems to me that if GM knew they could run the alternator and water pump 25% slower and the car would still work at idle then they would have done so. I listened to the "they're great" crowd here and it basically screwed me. When I get into a traffic situation I find I just get by instead of not having to even worry.
I do run highways a fair bit and it works fine there. As long as you're not idling a bunch you're good. So, as I first posted, if you do a fair bit of idling and especially if you'll be in traffic or idling at night then I would not take a chance with that part.
Peter
Car temp creeps up in traffic or when idling a lot.
Voltage slowly drops in traffic or when idling a lot.
Power steering doesn't work quite as well at idle. A slight rev of the engine and the wheel is much easier to turn.
So don't be so arrogant to tell me what I experience is BS. Maybe it works for your typical driving but I noticed a change in all 3 since installing the pulley. If I'm in traffic and the temps are climbing and the voltage is dropping I can drive in 1st at 1000rpm or even just hold 1000rpm while stopped and the car will respond positively so it's definately the accessory speed. I had to turn off the AC in a big traffic jamb one evening when it was maybe 80F out to keep the car from over heating - and I don't mean the stock hi fan temps either, it hit 245F and was still climbing. I had no-where to turn for a stretch and nothing was moving. If the AC didn't work then the next step was pulling over. I had no problems with the car running hot like that before the U/D pulley. We don't get hot days like in Texas either so I don't want to see the O/P who lives in Texas go into this blindly.
Seems to me that if GM knew they could run the alternator and water pump 25% slower and the car would still work at idle then they would have done so. I listened to the "they're great" crowd here and it basically screwed me. When I get into a traffic situation I find I just get by instead of not having to even worry.
I do run highways a fair bit and it works fine there. As long as you're not idling a bunch you're good. So, as I first posted, if you do a fair bit of idling and especially if you'll be in traffic or idling at night then I would not take a chance with that part.
Peter
4th Gear
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
I know it's a different car and exhaust system but I gained 12 rwhp by hollowing out my cats on my old 01 WS.6. Yes, it was louder and it changed the smell of the exhaust, but I didn't care, lol
Back then money was tight, so I did everyting I could for a HP gain, lol. Now, when I start my GF's 427ci, 02 Z-28 in the garage, I have to vacate the area immediately before I get choked out, lol
Back then money was tight, so I did everyting I could for a HP gain, lol. Now, when I start my GF's 427ci, 02 Z-28 in the garage, I have to vacate the area immediately before I get choked out, lol
Advanced
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 50
Likes: 0
Symptoms of inhaling gas fumes;
reddening of nose, gums and feat; salivation; restlessness; formication (sensation that resembles that of insects crawling on (or under) the skin); muscular weakness; respiratory failure; heart attack; clonic spasms (sudden, violent, involuntary muscular contraction), and then death.
Oh it also digs holes in that oh so precious layer of gunk keeping space in space and you down here.
Keep your cats. Install an intake and find some tubes with cats already, or find a mechanic to weld some in. It's technically still breaking the rules, but, you've got cats!
reddening of nose, gums and feat; salivation; restlessness; formication (sensation that resembles that of insects crawling on (or under) the skin); muscular weakness; respiratory failure; heart attack; clonic spasms (sudden, violent, involuntary muscular contraction), and then death.
Oh it also digs holes in that oh so precious layer of gunk keeping space in space and you down here.
Keep your cats. Install an intake and find some tubes with cats already, or find a mechanic to weld some in. It's technically still breaking the rules, but, you've got cats!
Last edited by anonymouscoward; Nov 8, 2010 at 03:37 PM.
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Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,189
Likes: 4
From: Freeport, FL
Symptoms of inhaling gas fumes;
reddening of nose, gums and feat; salivation; restlessness; formication (sensation that resembles that of insects crawling on (or under) the skin); muscular weakness; respiratory failure; heart attack; clonic spasms (sudden, violent, involuntary muscular contraction), and then death.
Oh it also digs holes in that oh so precious layer of gunk keeping space in space and you down here.
Keep your cats. Install an intake and find some tubes with cats already, or find a mechanic to weld some in. It's technically still breaking the rules, but, you've got cats!
reddening of nose, gums and feat; salivation; restlessness; formication (sensation that resembles that of insects crawling on (or under) the skin); muscular weakness; respiratory failure; heart attack; clonic spasms (sudden, violent, involuntary muscular contraction), and then death.
Oh it also digs holes in that oh so precious layer of gunk keeping space in space and you down here.
Keep your cats. Install an intake and find some tubes with cats already, or find a mechanic to weld some in. It's technically still breaking the rules, but, you've got cats!
Very true stuff. Eating to many bananas could lead to potassium poisoning also. Eating too many oranges could lead to Vitamin C over dose. Taking too much tylenol could cause liver failure.
Hey, how many smokers are on here telling everyone to keep your cats? Oh, for those concerned about personal health, who here drinks alcohol, takes medications of ANY kind? Come on, have you ever read the side-effects of any medication, prescription or OTC???
Seriously guys, I think there are other things to worry about than whether or not a race car has cats.
You guys are great though and I love this forum.
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 18,048
Likes: 53
From: long Island NY
I do agree with you, the cats belong on cars unless their off foad.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,189
Likes: 4
From: Freeport, FL
"Pro tip" Cobalt = non-race car
Cobalt SS = race car
Corvette = race car
Focus = non-race car
Mustang V6 = non-race car
Mustang GT = race car
Get it douche?
If you want to be a tree hugging hippie, go buy a Prius.
And Hell, I hope I am the reason the world suck's. At least I know my presence on earth is a profound one
p.s. you're special and Jesus loves you :o
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 6,993
Likes: 25
Any Cobalt a RACE car-
Today's V6 Stang has 300+ hp
I've seen some RADICAL Ford Focus's
The point is, if it's a street car, leave the cats on for several reasons. If it's a track only car-go crazy with it.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,189
Likes: 4
From: Freeport, FL
Here let me quote anonymouscoward to address the whole "they belong on there" montra; "Making something illegal isn't going to stop it from happening." 5/2/2010
The fact is, they're our cars and we'll do whatever we want to them. Leave them stock, chop em' up, turbo, nitrous, have exhaust pipes sticking outta the hood, plaster "fast and furious" decals all over um, doesn't matter, we are gonna do what we want with our posessions.
Opinions are like @ssholes, everyone has one and only sometimes is it appropriate to share it
kinda funny actually, I still have the cats on my car :o oops, I guess I should be on the other side of the discussion. Guess I'm justa pro-choice kinda guy.
Jesus built my hotrod
It's a love affair
Mainly, Jesus and my hotrod
ding a ding dang my dang a long ling long
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,189
Likes: 4
From: Freeport, FL
[QUOTE=dougbfresh;1575868184]Any Cobalt a RACE car-
QUOTE]
To steer further off subject. GM has made, and probably still does make claims that their Ecotech engine is capable of 1000hp with "off the shelf" parts. Not too bad for 1/3 the cubes. Granted "off the shelf" does not mean that you can hit up Autozone for them, but GM does offer the bolt-ons to do it, aparently.
Sorry, thinking about the Cobalt just made me think about that. Again, I realize i'm getting further off subject, we can go back to arguing now
http://papers.sae.org/2002-01-3354/
QUOTE]
To steer further off subject. GM has made, and probably still does make claims that their Ecotech engine is capable of 1000hp with "off the shelf" parts. Not too bad for 1/3 the cubes. Granted "off the shelf" does not mean that you can hit up Autozone for them, but GM does offer the bolt-ons to do it, aparently.
Sorry, thinking about the Cobalt just made me think about that. Again, I realize i'm getting further off subject, we can go back to arguing now
http://papers.sae.org/2002-01-3354/
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 6,993
Likes: 25
C'mon now, I know you're not stupid and are capable of understanding the example for the usage of "race car"
Here let me quote anonymouscoward to address the whole "they belong on there" montra; "Making something illegal isn't going to stop it from happening." 5/2/2010
The fact is, they're our cars and we'll do whatever we want to them. Leave them stock, chop em' up, turbo, nitrous, have exhaust pipes sticking outta the hood, plaster "fast and furious" decals all over um, doesn't matter, we are gonna do what we want with our posessions.
Opinions are like @ssholes, everyone has one and only sometimes is it appropriate to share it
kinda funny actually, I still have the cats on my car :o oops, I guess I should be on the other side of the discussion. Guess I'm justa pro-choice kinda guy.
Jesus built my hotrod
It's a love affair
Mainly, Jesus and my hotrod
ding a ding dang my dang a long ling long
Here let me quote anonymouscoward to address the whole "they belong on there" montra; "Making something illegal isn't going to stop it from happening." 5/2/2010
The fact is, they're our cars and we'll do whatever we want to them. Leave them stock, chop em' up, turbo, nitrous, have exhaust pipes sticking outta the hood, plaster "fast and furious" decals all over um, doesn't matter, we are gonna do what we want with our posessions.
Opinions are like @ssholes, everyone has one and only sometimes is it appropriate to share it
kinda funny actually, I still have the cats on my car :o oops, I guess I should be on the other side of the discussion. Guess I'm justa pro-choice kinda guy.
Jesus built my hotrod
It's a love affair
Mainly, Jesus and my hotrod
ding a ding dang my dang a long ling long
Race Director
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 16,935
Likes: 26
From: Lackey, my own dragstrip VA.
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