Brake lights not working
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From: Titusville Florida
Brake lights not working
2003 Coupe
Ok guys I have a weird brake light problem.
The only brake light that is working is the 3rd brake light.
Also only the front flashers work, I can get the rear flashers to work if I push the flasher button in a little further past the detent and hold it.
I replaced all the bulbs front and rear, including the marker lights.
I checked both fuses with a multimeter and they are good.
I'm guesing since the third(Center) brake light works the brake light switch is good.
Does anyone have a schematic that would help me out?
and maybe even some suggestions?
Thanks
Tony
Ok guys I have a weird brake light problem.
The only brake light that is working is the 3rd brake light.
Also only the front flashers work, I can get the rear flashers to work if I push the flasher button in a little further past the detent and hold it.
I replaced all the bulbs front and rear, including the marker lights.
I checked both fuses with a multimeter and they are good.
I'm guesing since the third(Center) brake light works the brake light switch is good.
Does anyone have a schematic that would help me out?
and maybe even some suggestions?
Thanks
Tony
Last edited by NavyGunner1980; May 22, 2016 at 08:59 AM. Reason: Added Description of Car
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,365
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Couple things I would do personally...
1. Check the rear sockets to confirm they have power.
2. Check the brake light switch near the brake pedal to again confirm it has power.
What year is your car? Might help with the schematic. The hazard switch is a common failure of this issue though.
1. Check the rear sockets to confirm they have power.
2. Check the brake light switch near the brake pedal to again confirm it has power.
What year is your car? Might help with the schematic. The hazard switch is a common failure of this issue though.
Last edited by Frank4202; May 21, 2016 at 09:30 PM.
Melting Slicks
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Le Mans Master
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From: OK
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 113
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From: Titusville Florida
You might want to read through the following thread as it pretty much describes your symptoms and the conclusion was that the Multi-Function switch was the cause:
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...lp-please.html
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...lp-please.html
Thanks
Tony
Thread Starter
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From: Titusville Florida
I would disagree but there are the 5 diagrams you need. Not simple to follow but here they are:
Attachment 47984325
Attachment 47984326
Attachment 47984327
Attachment 47984328
Attachment 47984329
Attachment 47984325
Attachment 47984326
Attachment 47984327
Attachment 47984328
Attachment 47984329
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 113
Likes: 4
From: Titusville Florida
I would disagree but there are the 5 diagrams you need. Not simple to follow but here they are:
Attachment 47984325
Attachment 47984326
Attachment 47984327
Attachment 47984328
Attachment 47984329
Attachment 47984325
Attachment 47984326
Attachment 47984327
Attachment 47984328
Attachment 47984329
If I hold the Hazard switch in and the turn signals operate normaly, front and back, wouldn't that rule out the multifunction switch?
I Appreciate your thoughts on this.
Thanks
Tony
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Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 113
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From: Titusville Florida
No but the Front ones do, unless I hold the Hazrd switch in then they all do, thats why I was leaning towards the Hazard switch, I haven't had time to look at the schematics of the switches to see why this may be happening, any Ideas?
Thanks
Tony
Thanks
Tony
Le Mans Master
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From: Columbia SC
Could still be the MF switch since the stop lights use different MF switch circuits than the turn signals. They are the same bulb filaments though.
Let me think on it and see what 8VETTE7 says. You might have a Hazard switch issue since both the stop lights and both turn signals do not work.
If you decide which one to replace I would start with the Hazard switch since it is cheaper and would still allow you to replace the MF switch with everything removed.
I have a write up on 4 ways to replace or go around the Hazard switch I can provide.
Another way is to actually test the output of the Hazard switch to see if it is all or part of the issue. We can help with that.
Mr. Sam
Let me think on it and see what 8VETTE7 says. You might have a Hazard switch issue since both the stop lights and both turn signals do not work.
If you decide which one to replace I would start with the Hazard switch since it is cheaper and would still allow you to replace the MF switch with everything removed.
I have a write up on 4 ways to replace or go around the Hazard switch I can provide.
Another way is to actually test the output of the Hazard switch to see if it is all or part of the issue. We can help with that.
Mr. Sam
Thread Starter
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From: Titusville Florida
Could still be the MF switch since the stop lights use different MF switch circuits than the turn signals. They are the same bulb filaments though.
Let me think on it and see what 8VETTE7 says. You might have a Hazard switch issue since both the stop lights and both turn signals do not work.
If you decide which one to replace I would start with the Hazard switch since it is cheaper and would still allow you to replace the MF switch with everything removed.
I have a write up on 4 ways to replace or go around the Hazard switch I can provide.
Another way is to actually test the output of the Hazard switch to see if it is all or part of the issue. We can help with that.
Mr. Sam
Let me think on it and see what 8VETTE7 says. You might have a Hazard switch issue since both the stop lights and both turn signals do not work.
If you decide which one to replace I would start with the Hazard switch since it is cheaper and would still allow you to replace the MF switch with everything removed.
I have a write up on 4 ways to replace or go around the Hazard switch I can provide.
Another way is to actually test the output of the Hazard switch to see if it is all or part of the issue. We can help with that.
Mr. Sam
Those 4 way to do it instructions would come in Handy, I'm new to the Corvette world and sometimes have problems locating the parts and how to get to them.
Tony
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From: Titusville Florida
You stated that the rear turn signal light do NOT flash when the turn signal switch ( multi function switch) is turned ON.
Do the front turn signal lights flash when the turn signals are turned ON?
If yes then the problem is the MFS. If NO then the hazard switch COULD be the problem. In the normal position (first diagram above) the voltage to the MFS (PNK wire) should go through the "ELEC Flasher" shown in the first diagram and might NOT if that ELEC flasher portion is bad. Fairly easy to replace the ELEC flasher portion for the turn signals. Here is a link to Sam's 4 solutions:
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...post1589443564
You can also test for voltage on the PPL wire out of the Hazard switch with the turn signal in the ON position. If there is NO voltage then the ELEC flasher portion of the hazard switch is bad. If you have voltage then the MFS is the bad component.
Do the front turn signal lights flash when the turn signals are turned ON?
If yes then the problem is the MFS. If NO then the hazard switch COULD be the problem. In the normal position (first diagram above) the voltage to the MFS (PNK wire) should go through the "ELEC Flasher" shown in the first diagram and might NOT if that ELEC flasher portion is bad. Fairly easy to replace the ELEC flasher portion for the turn signals. Here is a link to Sam's 4 solutions:
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...post1589443564
You can also test for voltage on the PPL wire out of the Hazard switch with the turn signal in the ON position. If there is NO voltage then the ELEC flasher portion of the hazard switch is bad. If you have voltage then the MFS is the bad component.
The REAR lights don't flash when the flashers are on, and don't light when the turn signal is on, unless I push the flasher switch past the latched on position then the flashers work, the parking lights work normally in all cases, and the front turn indicators work as they should, the sockets only have 3 wires going to them, I'm assuming one is a common ground and the other two run to each filament in the bulb, and since I can get both filaments to light under certain conditions, I'm thinking the wiring harness from the lights to the switches are good, so I'm guessing it's one of three switches, the brake light switch, the Hazard switch or the multifunction switch, since the brakes and the flashers use the same filament and the parking lights use a seperate filament.
What would really help me is the schematic for the Front lights and the 3rd brake light since it functions fine.
I noticed two brake switches in contact with the brake pedal, is one for the third brake light?
Thanks again
Tony
Last edited by NavyGunner1980; May 23, 2016 at 07:35 PM.
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So, you're saying the hazards work when you're holding the hazard switch in all the way.
FYI, the individual signal wires are not switched inside the hazard switch. The front flashing and the rear not flashing is pointing to the MFS.
Only the center brake light working means the brake light switch is fine since the same switch does all the brake lights. The hazard switch could be the issue since there is a contact that switches the brake power inside it. The MFS could also once again be the issue since the MFS switches each rear turn filament between the flasher or the brake light switch.
So, my conclusion would be the MFS since both the brake and signal don't work and it has switch contacts that could cause both to fail. Otherwise, you had multiple different failures at the same time.
FYI, the individual signal wires are not switched inside the hazard switch. The front flashing and the rear not flashing is pointing to the MFS.
Only the center brake light working means the brake light switch is fine since the same switch does all the brake lights. The hazard switch could be the issue since there is a contact that switches the brake power inside it. The MFS could also once again be the issue since the MFS switches each rear turn filament between the flasher or the brake light switch.
So, my conclusion would be the MFS since both the brake and signal don't work and it has switch contacts that could cause both to fail. Otherwise, you had multiple different failures at the same time.
Last edited by lionelhutz; May 23, 2016 at 08:01 PM.
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From: Titusville Florida
So, you're saying the hazards work when you're holding the hazard switch in all the way.
FYI, the individual signal wires are not switched inside the hazard switch. The front flashing and the rear not flashing is pointing to the MFS.
Only the center brake light working means the brake light switch is fine since the same switch does all the brake lights. The hazard switch could be the issue since there is a contact that switches the brake power inside it. The MFS could also once again be the issue since the MFS switches each rear turn filament between the flasher or the brake light switch.
So, my conclusion would be the MFS since both the brake and signal don't work and it has switch contacts that could cause both to fail. Otherwise, you had multiple different failures at the same time.
FYI, the individual signal wires are not switched inside the hazard switch. The front flashing and the rear not flashing is pointing to the MFS.
Only the center brake light working means the brake light switch is fine since the same switch does all the brake lights. The hazard switch could be the issue since there is a contact that switches the brake power inside it. The MFS could also once again be the issue since the MFS switches each rear turn filament between the flasher or the brake light switch.
So, my conclusion would be the MFS since both the brake and signal don't work and it has switch contacts that could cause both to fail. Otherwise, you had multiple different failures at the same time.
I'm beginning to think this car was in a flood, but no indication of that in the "Car Fax".
Thank you guys for all your help. I really do appreciate it.
Thanks
Tony
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From: Titusville Florida
You have the schematic for the front lights ( diagram 2 and 3) that I posted above. Look at the title on the diagram as one is left and the other right front.
Sorry about not posting the 3rd brake light diagram. Here it is:
Attachment 47984504
Notice it is super simple and not related at all to the Hazard switch or MFS so it may not be of any help. JMHO It does however show the role of the stop lamp switch and connector I that goes back to the first diagram....
Sorry about not posting the 3rd brake light diagram. Here it is:
Attachment 47984504
Notice it is super simple and not related at all to the Hazard switch or MFS so it may not be of any help. JMHO It does however show the role of the stop lamp switch and connector I that goes back to the first diagram....
Should the brake lights come on if the hand brake is applied? and where is that switch located?
Sorry for all the questions, I'm new to this vehicle, and have no Idea where to find this stuff.
Tony
Last edited by NavyGunner1980; May 24, 2016 at 08:34 AM.
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Do you uknow if the Hand brake has a switch?
Do you know what the other switch is besides the brake switch?
How do I know which post is #14?
Thanks
Tony
Last edited by NavyGunner1980; May 24, 2016 at 12:03 PM.
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See in BLUE above.
I gave you some help to try to isolate the issue in post #14. Did you try that and what did you find?
Electrical issues are no stranger to the C5. Probably comes from the fact that in the early 90's GM hired away from Lucas Electric their top engineers and put them in charge of designing the C5 electrics and electronics..
I gave you some help to try to isolate the issue in post #14. Did you try that and what did you find?
Electrical issues are no stranger to the C5. Probably comes from the fact that in the early 90's GM hired away from Lucas Electric their top engineers and put them in charge of designing the C5 electrics and electronics..
Thanks again for all your help
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There will be a switch on the brake pedal that disengages the cruise control.
The handbrake has a switch that lights the warning light in the cluster.
The handbrake has a switch that lights the warning light in the cluster.
Last edited by lionelhutz; May 24, 2016 at 12:32 PM.
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Ghost in the machine
You have the schematic for the front lights ( diagram 2 and 3) that I posted above. Look at the title on the diagram as one is left and the other right front.
Sorry about not posting the 3rd brake light diagram. Here it is:
Attachment 47984504
Notice it is super simple and not related at all to the Hazard switch or MFS so it may not be of any help. JMHO It does however show the role of the stop lamp switch and connector I that goes back to the first diagram....
Sorry about not posting the 3rd brake light diagram. Here it is:
Attachment 47984504
Notice it is super simple and not related at all to the Hazard switch or MFS so it may not be of any help. JMHO It does however show the role of the stop lamp switch and connector I that goes back to the first diagram....
is this a sign of a bad connection or loose ground, or just random gremlins running around?......
I don't have a shop mirror so I dont know if the brake lights are working now or not. I will keep everyone posted.
Again thanks to everyone for your help and sugestions.
If anything, I'm learning where all the peices parts are located.