Blind Spot Mirror
Race Director
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 14,555
Likes: 1,255
From: Saint Albans, WV
I think the best location is really what you get used to. I mount mine on the inside corners.
Team Owner
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,074
Likes: 296
From: San Francisco CA
[QUOTE=08vycpe;1571507341]
That is incorrect. GM agrees with the method I described and has published this. I'll try to find the document.
Popular Mechanics December 2007 also shows the method I described. They use the head lean to get the same result of adjusting the mirror so the driver leaves your rear view mirror, enters your side view mirror and then enters your peripheral vision. There are pictures in that issue that show the side view mirrors INCORRECTLY adjusted to show down the side of the car and CORRECTLY to show the blind spots in the mirrors without seeing the side of the car. I can't attach the illustrations from the magazine but here is the text.
Published in the December 2007 issue article by Mike Allen.
A: I had a long chat over dinner with an engineer from a major auto company a couple of years back about the subject of side view mirror adjustment. In addition to being an engineer, this guy holds a Ph.D. in psychology, specializing in human factors and ergonomics. And we both agreed that people often don’t adjust their rearview mirrors correctly. The interior mirror should be set to see straight back along the road, as most people do. But most drivers set the mirrors mounted on the doors to duplicate this view. The engineer suggested that the proper use of these mirrors is to let you visualize the blind spots flanking your car, not to see straight back.
Here’s his procedure for adjusting the mirrors, and it’s what I have always done myself.
Adjust the driver’s seat to the correct position. Lean your head and torso over to the left until your head contacts the window glass. I know, that seems too far. But trust me. Now, adjust the left-side mirror outward until you can barely see your own fender in it. Next, lean over to the right a similar distance, and adjust the right-side mirror so you can just see your own rear fender. Sit up straight. Your mirrors are now set to allow you to see other cars in your blind spot. You won’t need to swivel your neck around to be aware of traffic hiding at 60 mph right beside you. And the interior mirror will still let you see the traffic directly behind.
This is the method that I have heard before.
That is incorrect. GM agrees with the method I described and has published this. I'll try to find the document.
Popular Mechanics December 2007 also shows the method I described. They use the head lean to get the same result of adjusting the mirror so the driver leaves your rear view mirror, enters your side view mirror and then enters your peripheral vision. There are pictures in that issue that show the side view mirrors INCORRECTLY adjusted to show down the side of the car and CORRECTLY to show the blind spots in the mirrors without seeing the side of the car. I can't attach the illustrations from the magazine but here is the text.
Published in the December 2007 issue article by Mike Allen.
A: I had a long chat over dinner with an engineer from a major auto company a couple of years back about the subject of side view mirror adjustment. In addition to being an engineer, this guy holds a Ph.D. in psychology, specializing in human factors and ergonomics. And we both agreed that people often don’t adjust their rearview mirrors correctly. The interior mirror should be set to see straight back along the road, as most people do. But most drivers set the mirrors mounted on the doors to duplicate this view. The engineer suggested that the proper use of these mirrors is to let you visualize the blind spots flanking your car, not to see straight back.
Here’s his procedure for adjusting the mirrors, and it’s what I have always done myself.
Adjust the driver’s seat to the correct position. Lean your head and torso over to the left until your head contacts the window glass. I know, that seems too far. But trust me. Now, adjust the left-side mirror outward until you can barely see your own fender in it. Next, lean over to the right a similar distance, and adjust the right-side mirror so you can just see your own rear fender. Sit up straight. Your mirrors are now set to allow you to see other cars in your blind spot. You won’t need to swivel your neck around to be aware of traffic hiding at 60 mph right beside you. And the interior mirror will still let you see the traffic directly behind.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,027
Likes: 0
From: The Lost Borough, NYC
[QUOTE=08vycpe;1571507341][B]
That is incorrect. GM agrees with the method I described and has published this. I'll try to find the document.
Popular Mechanics December 2007 also shows the method I described. They use the head lean to get the same result of adjusting the mirror so the driver leaves your rear view mirror, enters your side view mirror and then enters your peripheral vision. There are pictures in that issue that show the side view mirrors INCORRECTLY adjusted to show down the side of the car and CORRECTLY to show the blind spots in the mirrors without seeing the side of the car. I can't attach the illustrations from the magazine but here is the text.
Published in the December 2007 issue article by Mike Allen.
A: I had a long chat over dinner with an engineer from a major auto company a couple of years back about the subject of side view mirror adjustment. In addition to being an engineer, this guy holds a Ph.D. in psychology, specializing in human factors and ergonomics. And we both agreed that people often don’t adjust their rearview mirrors correctly. The interior mirror should be set to see straight back along the road, as most people do. But most drivers set the mirrors mounted on the doors to duplicate this view. The engineer suggested that the proper use of these mirrors is to let you visualize the blind spots flanking your car, not to see straight back.
Here’s his procedure for adjusting the mirrors, and it’s what I have always done myself.
Adjust the driver’s seat to the correct position. Lean your head and torso over to the left until your head contacts the window glass. I know, that seems too far. But trust me. Now, adjust the left-side mirror outward until you can barely see your own fender in it. Next, lean over to the right a similar distance, and adjust the right-side mirror so you can just see your own rear fender. Sit up straight. Your mirrors are now set to allow you to see other cars in your blind spot. You won’t need to swivel your neck around to be aware of traffic hiding at 60 mph right beside you. And the interior mirror will still let you see the traffic directly behind.
All the people you mention are engineers and/or execs of companies and do not qualify as "professional drivers". I hold a Class B commercial license, air brake qualified and have a tank endorsement (I can haul liquids). I drive for a living, and passed my commercial road test on the first try with ease.
Did you know your supposed to look in all your mirrors before you take off? Do you know why? Because your supposed to see if any objects are next to your vehicle. I dont care what an engineer from PM says or any corporate head of GM. You have to see the sides of your vehicle otherwise you can swipe something. I drive trucks with GVWR's of up to 70,000lbs and most of the time (here in NYC) I am squeezing through double parked cars with only an inch of clearance on each side, so tell me???? Do you think having my mirrors skin the vehicle is incorrect????????????
And yes this same philosophy applies to cars too! Which is why if I get a ticket my points and fines double (and my BAC cant be more than half otherwise I am considered DWI) on a commercial license becase we are supposed to know better!
To see the blind spot move your head forward (towards the windshield) and you can then see it. And as I said earlier, if the person in the other lanes knew how to drive they wouldnt linger in your blind spot in the first place, as I know not to myself, esp with trucks on the highway.
That is incorrect. GM agrees with the method I described and has published this. I'll try to find the document.
Popular Mechanics December 2007 also shows the method I described. They use the head lean to get the same result of adjusting the mirror so the driver leaves your rear view mirror, enters your side view mirror and then enters your peripheral vision. There are pictures in that issue that show the side view mirrors INCORRECTLY adjusted to show down the side of the car and CORRECTLY to show the blind spots in the mirrors without seeing the side of the car. I can't attach the illustrations from the magazine but here is the text.
Published in the December 2007 issue article by Mike Allen.
A: I had a long chat over dinner with an engineer from a major auto company a couple of years back about the subject of side view mirror adjustment. In addition to being an engineer, this guy holds a Ph.D. in psychology, specializing in human factors and ergonomics. And we both agreed that people often don’t adjust their rearview mirrors correctly. The interior mirror should be set to see straight back along the road, as most people do. But most drivers set the mirrors mounted on the doors to duplicate this view. The engineer suggested that the proper use of these mirrors is to let you visualize the blind spots flanking your car, not to see straight back.
Here’s his procedure for adjusting the mirrors, and it’s what I have always done myself.
Adjust the driver’s seat to the correct position. Lean your head and torso over to the left until your head contacts the window glass. I know, that seems too far. But trust me. Now, adjust the left-side mirror outward until you can barely see your own fender in it. Next, lean over to the right a similar distance, and adjust the right-side mirror so you can just see your own rear fender. Sit up straight. Your mirrors are now set to allow you to see other cars in your blind spot. You won’t need to swivel your neck around to be aware of traffic hiding at 60 mph right beside you. And the interior mirror will still let you see the traffic directly behind.
Did you know your supposed to look in all your mirrors before you take off? Do you know why? Because your supposed to see if any objects are next to your vehicle. I dont care what an engineer from PM says or any corporate head of GM. You have to see the sides of your vehicle otherwise you can swipe something. I drive trucks with GVWR's of up to 70,000lbs and most of the time (here in NYC) I am squeezing through double parked cars with only an inch of clearance on each side, so tell me???? Do you think having my mirrors skin the vehicle is incorrect????????????
And yes this same philosophy applies to cars too! Which is why if I get a ticket my points and fines double (and my BAC cant be more than half otherwise I am considered DWI) on a commercial license becase we are supposed to know better!
To see the blind spot move your head forward (towards the windshield) and you can then see it. And as I said earlier, if the person in the other lanes knew how to drive they wouldnt linger in your blind spot in the first place, as I know not to myself, esp with trucks on the highway.
Last edited by pTr73; Sep 16, 2009 at 08:10 AM.
Race Director
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 10,909
Likes: 2,701
From: Phila Suburbs 2023 C8 & 2013 650ix
And as I said earlier, if the person in the other lanes knew how to drive they wouldnt linger in your blind spot in the first place, as I know not to myself, esp with trucks on the highway.
Yea, and if wishes were horses, beggars would ride. Back to reality.
Last time I checked, my vette is not a truck. If I had 4 mirrors per side I'd surely have all views covered. But, we only have one mirror per side so those mirrors should be focused on the most common and important usage and that ISN'T BACKING UP, IT'S LANE CHANGES.
10-4 Good Buddy.
Yea, and if wishes were horses, beggars would ride. Back to reality.
Last time I checked, my vette is not a truck. If I had 4 mirrors per side I'd surely have all views covered. But, we only have one mirror per side so those mirrors should be focused on the most common and important usage and that ISN'T BACKING UP, IT'S LANE CHANGES.
10-4 Good Buddy.
Racer
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 353
Likes: 2
From: Edmonton Alberta
[QUOTE=08vycpe;1571507341]
Just the driver’s seat to the correct position. Lean your head and torso over to the left until your head contacts the window glass. I know, that seems too far. But trust me. Now, adjust the left-side mirror outward until you can barely see your own fender in it. Next, lean over to the right a similar distance, and adjust the right-side mirror so you can just see your own rear fender. Sit up straight. Your mirrors are now set to allow you to see other cars in your blind spot. You won’t need to swivel your neck around to be aware of traffic hiding at 60 mph right beside you. And the interior mirror will still let you see the traffic directly behind.
Yesterday I adjusted my mirrors outward this way.
I can move my head against the window to see the side of my car.
This way of adjusting mirrors is awsome...I can see everything before I shoulder check.
Just the driver’s seat to the correct position. Lean your head and torso over to the left until your head contacts the window glass. I know, that seems too far. But trust me. Now, adjust the left-side mirror outward until you can barely see your own fender in it. Next, lean over to the right a similar distance, and adjust the right-side mirror so you can just see your own rear fender. Sit up straight. Your mirrors are now set to allow you to see other cars in your blind spot. You won’t need to swivel your neck around to be aware of traffic hiding at 60 mph right beside you. And the interior mirror will still let you see the traffic directly behind.
I can move my head against the window to see the side of my car.
This way of adjusting mirrors is awsome...I can see everything before I shoulder check.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,027
Likes: 0
From: The Lost Borough, NYC
And as I said earlier, if the person in the other lanes knew how to drive they wouldnt linger in your blind spot in the first place, as I know not to myself, esp with trucks on the highway.
Yea, and if wishes were horses, beggars would ride. Back to reality.
Last time I checked, my vette is not a truck. If I had 4 mirrors per side I'd surely have all views covered. But, we only have one mirror per side so those mirrors should be focused on the most common and important usage and that ISN'T BACKING UP, IT'S LANE CHANGES.
10-4 Good Buddy.
Yea, and if wishes were horses, beggars would ride. Back to reality.
Last time I checked, my vette is not a truck. If I had 4 mirrors per side I'd surely have all views covered. But, we only have one mirror per side so those mirrors should be focused on the most common and important usage and that ISN'T BACKING UP, IT'S LANE CHANGES.
10-4 Good Buddy.
If you want to focus on more important things such as lane changes, then look over your shoulder as your supposed to, unless you have become that lazy. Adjusting the mirrors outwards disables you from seeing the sides of the vehicles. And yes backing up is just as important because you might run someone over or hit something. And you cant see certain spots even if you turn around and look behind you.
If you cant at least see a mere fraction of the side of the car how are you supposed to know where the car is in relative to the roadway? That is why its incorrect to adjust them outward.
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Michael S. Palmer
Team Owner
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,074
Likes: 296
From: San Francisco CA
[QUOTE=08vycpe;1571507341]
That is incorrect. GM agrees with the method I described and has published this. I'll try to find the document.
Popular Mechanics December 2007 also shows the method I described. They use the head lean to get the same result of adjusting the mirror so the driver leaves your rear view mirror, enters your side view mirror and then enters your peripheral vision. There are pictures in that issue that show the side view mirrors INCORRECTLY adjusted to show down the side of the car and CORRECTLY to show the blind spots in the mirrors without seeing the side of the car. I can't attach the illustrations from the magazine but here is the text.
Published in the December 2007 issue article by Mike Allen.
A: I had a long chat over dinner with an engineer from a major auto company a couple of years back about the subject of side view mirror adjustment. In addition to being an engineer, this guy holds a Ph.D. in psychology, specializing in human factors and ergonomics. And we both agreed that people often don’t adjust their rearview mirrors correctly. The interior mirror should be set to see straight back along the road, as most people do. But most drivers set the mirrors mounted on the doors to duplicate this view. The engineer suggested that the proper use of these mirrors is to let you visualize the blind spots flanking your car, not to see straight back.
Here’s his procedure for adjusting the mirrors, and it’s what I have always done myself.
Adjust the driver’s seat to the correct position. Lean your head and torso over to the left until your head contacts the window glass. I know, that seems too far. But trust me. Now, adjust the left-side mirror outward until you can barely see your own fender in it. Next, lean over to the right a similar distance, and adjust the right-side mirror so you can just see your own rear fender. Sit up straight. Your mirrors are now set to allow you to see other cars in your blind spot. You won’t need to swivel your neck around to be aware of traffic hiding at 60 mph right beside you. And the interior mirror will still let you see the traffic directly behind.
How far do you lean over to do the right side passenger mirror to do adjustment?
I did try this adjustment and find it awkward. I'm not sure if it is better than the way I had it adjusted which is I have the mirrors outward then I can see the car when it disappears from my rear view mirror then I can car coming up on me my side mirror. I don't see the rear side of my car.
This other way I notice there is more coverage of the farthest right lane and farthest left lane if you are in the middle. But there is like half a second blind spot. I like to be able to see the car coming up on me and next to me and I find that I can't see the car coming up on me in side mirrors until it is right there next to me which would be too late by adjusting the mirrors as stated above.
That is incorrect. GM agrees with the method I described and has published this. I'll try to find the document.
Popular Mechanics December 2007 also shows the method I described. They use the head lean to get the same result of adjusting the mirror so the driver leaves your rear view mirror, enters your side view mirror and then enters your peripheral vision. There are pictures in that issue that show the side view mirrors INCORRECTLY adjusted to show down the side of the car and CORRECTLY to show the blind spots in the mirrors without seeing the side of the car. I can't attach the illustrations from the magazine but here is the text.
Published in the December 2007 issue article by Mike Allen.
A: I had a long chat over dinner with an engineer from a major auto company a couple of years back about the subject of side view mirror adjustment. In addition to being an engineer, this guy holds a Ph.D. in psychology, specializing in human factors and ergonomics. And we both agreed that people often don’t adjust their rearview mirrors correctly. The interior mirror should be set to see straight back along the road, as most people do. But most drivers set the mirrors mounted on the doors to duplicate this view. The engineer suggested that the proper use of these mirrors is to let you visualize the blind spots flanking your car, not to see straight back.
Here’s his procedure for adjusting the mirrors, and it’s what I have always done myself.
Adjust the driver’s seat to the correct position. Lean your head and torso over to the left until your head contacts the window glass. I know, that seems too far. But trust me. Now, adjust the left-side mirror outward until you can barely see your own fender in it. Next, lean over to the right a similar distance, and adjust the right-side mirror so you can just see your own rear fender. Sit up straight. Your mirrors are now set to allow you to see other cars in your blind spot. You won’t need to swivel your neck around to be aware of traffic hiding at 60 mph right beside you. And the interior mirror will still let you see the traffic directly behind.
I did try this adjustment and find it awkward. I'm not sure if it is better than the way I had it adjusted which is I have the mirrors outward then I can see the car when it disappears from my rear view mirror then I can car coming up on me my side mirror. I don't see the rear side of my car.
This other way I notice there is more coverage of the farthest right lane and farthest left lane if you are in the middle. But there is like half a second blind spot. I like to be able to see the car coming up on me and next to me and I find that I can't see the car coming up on me in side mirrors until it is right there next to me which would be too late by adjusting the mirrors as stated above.
Race Director
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 10,909
Likes: 2,701
From: Phila Suburbs 2023 C8 & 2013 650ix
Once again, simply adjust them all the way out and do a simple check on the highway. I find that as I lose sight of an overtaking car in the inside mirror, I then pick them up on the outside mirror. And there is a slight overlap. This is not that complicated.
Team Owner
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,074
Likes: 296
From: San Francisco CA
I never said the vette was a truck, and 2 out of those 4 mirrors are "guide mirrors" which gives you a more panoramic view of the tail end of the truck. The other 2 are standard mirrors which still have to skin the sides.
If you want to focus on more important things such as lane changes, then look over your shoulder as your supposed to, unless you have become that lazy. Adjusting the mirrors outwards disables you from seeing the sides of the vehicles. And yes backing up is just as important because you might run someone over or hit something. And you cant see certain spots even if you turn around and look behind you.
If you cant at least see a mere fraction of the side of the car how are you supposed to know where the car is in relative to the roadway? That is why its incorrect to adjust them outward.
If you want to focus on more important things such as lane changes, then look over your shoulder as your supposed to, unless you have become that lazy. Adjusting the mirrors outwards disables you from seeing the sides of the vehicles. And yes backing up is just as important because you might run someone over or hit something. And you cant see certain spots even if you turn around and look behind you.
If you cant at least see a mere fraction of the side of the car how are you supposed to know where the car is in relative to the roadway? That is why its incorrect to adjust them outward.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,086
Likes: 1
From: Michigan
How can something so simple seem so complex. Adjust as such, car leaves your rear view mirror, enters your side view mirror IMMEDIATELY, leaves your side view mirror and enters your peripheral vision IMMEDIATELY. No blind spots. BTW...my Silverado has a one glass simple mirror just like your Corvette. The curb view is automatic is "R" and adjusted automatically up and out in drive. Nevermind.
Please end this thread.
Please end this thread.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 5,394
Likes: 281
From: cumming ga
z51vett
This is from a driving class don't remember where.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 1,196
Likes: 107
From: Fairview, TX
Here it is from my company news letter. (Ithought everone new how te set their mirrors 
) I've been doing this ever since my drivers training from when I was 16. Works in every passenger vehicle.
How To Eliminate The Dreaded "Blind Spot”
1. The first step is to adjust the rear-view mirror to do exactly that - give you a view directly to the rear. Position it so that it best covers your view straight out the rear window. Don't bother tilting it to one side or the other to assist with your view of traffic to either side of your car. That's what the side mirrors are for.
2. Next, lean your head until it almost touches the driver's side window. Then, adjust your left side mirrors so that you can just barely see the side of your car, and no more than that.
3. Lean your head to the right towards the middle of the car and adjust the right side mirror so that you can just barely see the right side of your car. You should NOT be able to see the side of your car when your head is perfectly upright.
4. Check for blind spots by doing the following: While driving along a four-lane road in the right lane, note a vehicle in the left lane coming up to pass you from behind. Without moving your head, glance in the rear-view mirror and follow it as it approaches your car in the left lane. Just before it disappears from your view in the rear-view mirror, glance to the left side mirror. There it is. Now follow that vehicle in the side mirror as it begins to pass you. Then, just before it disappears from the side mirror, you should see it with your peripheral vision. Notice that without even turning your head, you never had a blind-spot. Then try it with the right side mirror. Watch as you pass a vehicle travelling in the right lane go from your peripheral vision, to your right side mirror, to your rear-view mirror. Again, no blind-spot. If there is a blind spot for even a fraction of a second, your side mirror adjustment needs some fine-tuning.
This procedure should be done every time you get into a car in which you have not adjusted the mirrors. It only takes seconds, and can make a big difference.
With the mirrors adjusted properly, a shoulder check to change lanes becomes more of a "shoulder peek", meaning you don't have to turn your head so far. That means your peripheral vision will still provide a view in front of you - no "blind spot" in front of you either, meaning less chance of rear-ending a vehicle that has suddenly stopped.
As a side benefit, with the side mirrors tilted out farther, you will no longer have to worry about the bright lights of a vehicle behind you glaring in your eyes.
It may take a little while to feel comfortable with not being able to see the side of your own car in the side mirrors (if you really need to see it every now and then, just tilt your head a little!). Also, it may take a little time to stop relying on the side mirrors for looking to the rear. But once you get used to it, you'll love it. You'll feel much more confident and comfortable in traffic.
) I've been doing this ever since my drivers training from when I was 16. Works in every passenger vehicle.How To Eliminate The Dreaded "Blind Spot”
1. The first step is to adjust the rear-view mirror to do exactly that - give you a view directly to the rear. Position it so that it best covers your view straight out the rear window. Don't bother tilting it to one side or the other to assist with your view of traffic to either side of your car. That's what the side mirrors are for.
2. Next, lean your head until it almost touches the driver's side window. Then, adjust your left side mirrors so that you can just barely see the side of your car, and no more than that.
3. Lean your head to the right towards the middle of the car and adjust the right side mirror so that you can just barely see the right side of your car. You should NOT be able to see the side of your car when your head is perfectly upright.
4. Check for blind spots by doing the following: While driving along a four-lane road in the right lane, note a vehicle in the left lane coming up to pass you from behind. Without moving your head, glance in the rear-view mirror and follow it as it approaches your car in the left lane. Just before it disappears from your view in the rear-view mirror, glance to the left side mirror. There it is. Now follow that vehicle in the side mirror as it begins to pass you. Then, just before it disappears from the side mirror, you should see it with your peripheral vision. Notice that without even turning your head, you never had a blind-spot. Then try it with the right side mirror. Watch as you pass a vehicle travelling in the right lane go from your peripheral vision, to your right side mirror, to your rear-view mirror. Again, no blind-spot. If there is a blind spot for even a fraction of a second, your side mirror adjustment needs some fine-tuning.
This procedure should be done every time you get into a car in which you have not adjusted the mirrors. It only takes seconds, and can make a big difference.
With the mirrors adjusted properly, a shoulder check to change lanes becomes more of a "shoulder peek", meaning you don't have to turn your head so far. That means your peripheral vision will still provide a view in front of you - no "blind spot" in front of you either, meaning less chance of rear-ending a vehicle that has suddenly stopped.
As a side benefit, with the side mirrors tilted out farther, you will no longer have to worry about the bright lights of a vehicle behind you glaring in your eyes.
It may take a little while to feel comfortable with not being able to see the side of your own car in the side mirrors (if you really need to see it every now and then, just tilt your head a little!). Also, it may take a little time to stop relying on the side mirrors for looking to the rear. But once you get used to it, you'll love it. You'll feel much more confident and comfortable in traffic.
Advanced
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 58
Likes: 3
Okay everyone listen up lean your head over to 2 inches from door glass adjust mirror to barely see side of car next lean over the to center of counsel and adjust mirror to barely see side of car inside is adjusted to lookout the center of the back glass.
z51vett
This is from a driving class don't remember where.
z51vett
This is from a driving class don't remember where.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 923
Likes: 37
From: Green Bay Wisconsin
It's really not that complicated. LOL
Douglas in Green Bay
Instructor
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 175
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Safety Car
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 3,732
Likes: 21
From: Napa Ca
I have a spot mirror on my C5. I find most usefull when merging onto a freeway when the seat belt tightens as you hit the entrance curve at speed. Can't quite do an over the shoulder look with the belt tightening up. Maybe I could slow the entrance a little to keep the belt from tightening...but then I'd get run over by a right lane bandit 
Wanted to install a spot on the wife's C6 but she can't stand the look
Wanted to install a spot on the wife's C6 but she can't stand the look
