Don't worry buddy, While I can't speak for anyone but myself, although there are thousands of happy Torco users, I will tell you first hand that on the 400 plus dyno runs I've made on my cars in the past,

Tuning a car with higher octane has allowed me to safely run more timing and make more HP


JB

 

I agree completely with this statement. The only way increasing octane is going to add HP is if timing was being pulled because the knock sensors detected detonation. This is beleivable in an engine with a compression ration that is higher than OEM or a boosted engine.

In theory, the spark would occur at top dead center (TDC), igniting the mixture and pushing down on the piston just as it began it's downward motion. However, since it takes a finite amount of time for the mixture to ignite and for the flame to travel across the combustion chamber, the spark needs a head start. So the plug is directed to fire before the piston reaches top dead center (TDC). The faster the engine is running, the more of a head start (timing advance) the spark needs. That's why timing advance is increased as RPM increases. In the old days, it was achieved by the weights and springs in the distributor, and a vacuum advance canister. Modern engines use a crank (or cam) angle sensor and a smart computer to determine when to fire the plug. That's the part that tuners can manipulate (ignition tables) along with air fuel ratio (fuel tables) to improve performance over the conservative OEM calibration.

When the knock sensors detect knock, they retard the timing (less advance) because this relieves the detonation (and reduces power)

As you can see, there would be an optiumim time for the plug to fire. Any sooner than that (TOO much advance), and the force of combustion would be trying to push the piston down while the crankshaft would be trying to push it up - i.e diminishing returns. Some would imply that spark advance is like boost - you can just keep increasing it and increasing octane for an endless supply of additional HP gain. This is not true.

The OEM's do leave some HP on the table to avoid detonation, but there is a limit to how much low hanging fruit exists.

 

Well the stock numbers are certainly beleivable. An additional 39 HP with with just an air intake, Torco and a tune, and another 40 HP w/ just the headers and a cat back - that's a total of 79 HP with just bolt ons, a tune, and Torco. Those numbers certainly do seem incredible.

Was the baseline dyno with 91 octane and a cooled motor?

 

Back to the original question........... You can increase the octane all you want. That alone will NOT increase your horsepower. It will allow you to mod the engine to provide more horsepower. As for all the other comments, no matter what you do or how much money you spend there will ALWAYS be someone faster.

 

The baseline was with 91 octane and the motor was "normalized", neither cooled or on the ragged edge of heat soak.

No argument with me on octane as I view it as a "burn slower" / "knock suppressant" and nothing more.

 

Thanks for the info on the dyno run and on

"I view it as a "burn slower" / "knock suppressant" and nothing more"

 

I see the use of Torco as a real benefit for those of us with Vararam or other effective CAI systems. I am already getting a little high-RPM KR on dyno pulls, and I'm thinking that at 100+ MPH, my A/F mix could be getting a little lean, leading to even more KR.

Vararam equipped cars are hard to tune effectively on a dyno, as you cannot duplicate the airflow effects at high MPH.

Since I don't drive that fast on the street, I'm OK with the tune being optimized for the street. But I do feel like I'm leaving a little something on the table when I go to the track.

Sounds like a can of Torco might just be the trick.

 

That makes perfect sense to me, since VR says they start to produce addtional air flow/pressure as low as 45 MPH!!

 

Multiple Dynos on my SRT4 showed an 8% FWHP gain with a High Octane tune and Torco. Dodge supplied the "Stage 2" PCM with 2 modes, normal and High Octane. The "normal" FWHP was 250, the High Octane was 270 FWHP. 20 HP on a tune and Torco from a 2.4L inline 4. The same 8% increase on a 376 RWHP 'Vette would be aprx 406 RWHP. Add the other bolt-on mods and it's believable for me.

 

I like your logic!!!

JB

 

I have not tried those products, but I am super impressed witht the various digital and mechanic devices that increase my gas mileage by up to 100%. I have a series of them attached to my car. I no longer buy gas since these devices now give me a a combined gas mileage of 2 million miles per gallon. Biggest problem is that soon I will need a larger gas tank since I am getting such gas mileage.

Yeah!!

 

As long as you can get 93 Octane you don't need a Booster unless you're using Forced Induction or you're greater than 10.9/1 Compression. In CA 91 Octane is the highest you can usually buy therefore CA cars will benefit. Here in VA I can buy 93 Octane anywhere.

 

I put 1 bottle of OCTANE BOOST (LUCAS ) in my C6 LS2 then drove around a few miles. After that WOT and i cant say there is any noticable difference. Im presumably running 96 Octane. Perhaps ill try it tomorrow with a few degrees of timing increase. I kind of have my doubts about this stuff but the jury is still out.
We dont have any torco around here to try.

 

FWIW, I have been running TORCO in my car for years. Yes it is tuned to run on Torco and 91 octane and it makes a great deal of HP as a result. If I didnt run Torco I would have to run 100 octane @ $5.60 per gallon. This is a great way for me to have the octane/KR I need to keep an engine like mine running for the last 3 years without any problems.

VR

 

Hey buddy,

I've got a case of Torco with your name on it!! I'll make you a VERY nice deal, and drop ship it to you. You'll have it by the weekend!!

You need to try the real deal...
I pmed you,
JB

 

Thanks JB.
I really appreciate the offer. Should i decide to go with it you
will be the first person to contact for some torco.
Great numbers on your LS3 . You sure have those ZO6 guys
scratching their heads.

THANKS AGAIN , LSCHLEM

 

I can't help think that the fact that the SRT4 is a turbo makes some difference in how the tuning would improve hp, don't you?

I find it totally incredible to think that improved octane can pick up the kind of horsepower on a Corvette that is being thrown around here. There is a limit to how much can be gained or lost through timing. It's not some magic potent. To pick up horsepower you ultimately have to pump more air through the engine. That is where intake, exhaust (including headers), cams, displacement, and combustion chamber design come in.

We have several years of history on how much can be gained with headers and a CAI. We know that they are good for about 25 rwhp, maybe 30-35 with a tune. So we are now saying that there is a gain of, what - 45 more rwhp just with timing advance?

 

You are correct about the dyno #'s from CAI you might get 5 and a good LT header will probably get an average of 30 More. The tune
usually is good for about 20 HP more on most LSx Cars.
On the subject of boosters such as increases on OCTANE, ALCOHOL
METH etc those cars make more power but it goes without saying
the tuning parameters indeed must change.

 

Another Torco Fan Here:

I've been using Torco Unleaded Accelerator since 2002 with no issues other than it makes your plugs unreadable.

I completely agree with those that state fuel additives do not increase horsepower, they slow the burn rate of the fuel, which by itself, will actually decrease horsepower. But by slowing the burn rate it makes the mixture less susceptible to detonating, allowing you to run more timing and consequently make more power.

In the case of a C6Z running on 91 in a hot environment, it would keep the knock sensors from triggering the ECU into retarding the timing.

I run it in both of my mustangs, #1 a 95 Cobra running 20lbs of boost on an 800 hp Renegade engine and #2 a 98 Cobra with 9lbs of boost in a mildly modified 4.6 4 Valve.

I don't use it in my Z06 because it is stock and no issues running it on Amoco 93.

 

I'll break down my HP increase one more time for you, so you can see the how it played out.

Bone stock on 91 = 376
bone stock with Torco/91 and a tweak on the tune=397
add a filter and bridge with the 91/torco, retune=415
add headers and catback, increase torco mixture alittle, retune=455

JB

We backed up the best run of 455 with a few 448s hot.