Comment about the automatic !
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,076
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From: Lake Forest CA
Comment about the automatic !
Way back I commented about the ZR-1 & about how I wished it were offered with an auto got accused of heresy & even suggested I turn in my membership here. Now I read about everyone crowing about the Z06 being offered with one & why the new Vipers sales are so soft because an auto isn't offered. I now feel vindicated & consider my self some what of a visionary. 
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 6,149
Likes: 11
From: Greater Detroit Metro MI, when I'm not travelling.
Way back I commented about the ZR-1 & about how I wished it were offered with an auto got accused of heresy & even suggested I turn in my membership here. Now I read about everyone crowing about the Z06 being offered with one & why the new Vipers sales are so soft because an auto isn't offered. I now feel vindicated & consider my self some what of a visionary.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 5,027
Likes: 320
From: N. CA
Way back I commented about the ZR-1 & about how I wished it were offered with an auto got accused of heresy & even suggested I turn in my membership here. Now I read about everyone crowing about the Z06 being offered with one & why the new Vipers sales are so soft because an auto isn't offered. I now feel vindicated & consider my self some what of a visionary.
You are right-on Turbolou. I said in 2005 if they developed a fast paddle shift type auto for the ZO6 then I was IN. Well, it's been a long 10 year wait, but next year that statement will be fulfilled.
This is not your Daddy's auto by far with very fast shift speeds right there with the likes of the Porsche PDK transmission and according to The General they have done just that!
The old school manual stick shift is so yesterday 20th century, I see that the new A8 offered by Corvette in their flagship high performance car as the future and 21st century.
The future is here!
http://gmauthority.com/blog/2014/03/...-transmission/
http://articles.sae.org/12782/
Last edited by BOBSZ06; Apr 22, 2014 at 02:28 PM.
Burning Brakes
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 893
Likes: 1
From: Lubbock, TX
a lot of people that have never driven a fast auto car that is setup right don't know what they are missing. If you have driven a 12' or newer CTS-V/ ZL1 auto, you would see the differences GM has made in their autos. They did a big revision in the trans tune that cut down on shift times and made it very responsive. no reason to waste time shifting gears
Scraping the splitter.
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 8,111
Likes: 1,029
St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15
You are right-on Turbolou. I said in 2005 if they developed a fast paddle shift type auto for the ZO6 then I was IN. Well, it's been a long 10 year wait, but next year that statement will be fulfilled.
This is not your Daddy's auto by far with very fast shift speeds right there with the likes of the Porsche PDK transmission and according to The General they have done just that!
The old school manual stick shift is so yesterday 20th century, I see that the new A8 offered by Corvette in their flagship high performance car as the future and 21st century.
The future is here!
http://gmauthority.com/blog/2014/03/...-transmission/
http://articles.sae.org/12782/
This is not your Daddy's auto by far with very fast shift speeds right there with the likes of the Porsche PDK transmission and according to The General they have done just that!
The old school manual stick shift is so yesterday 20th century, I see that the new A8 offered by Corvette in their flagship high performance car as the future and 21st century.
The future is here!
http://gmauthority.com/blog/2014/03/...-transmission/
http://articles.sae.org/12782/
Here is an interesting tidbit...BMW is building the M231i Racing club racer with an 8-speed torque convertor paddle-shifted auto in it rather than a DCT. Interesting times...
S.
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Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,076
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From: Lake Forest CA
reply
Nah, plenty of people like myself still think an old school torque converter automatic has no place in a sports car. But I have gone to enough "Corvettes at Carlisle", "Bowling Green Cruize-Ins" and "Corvetter Cruises" to understand that, sports-car heritage aside, the vast majority of buyers are older men looking for something to wax, keep miles off, drive gingerly and show off on the weekends, and to that demographic a soft automatic makes a lot of sense. In the end as long as it helps GM sell a lot of them it benefits me because I'll be able to get what I want for cheap.
Safety Car
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 4,905
Likes: 569
From: Bucks County PA
Nah, plenty of people like myself still think an old school torque converter automatic has no place in a sports car. But I have gone to enough "Corvettes at Carlisle", "Bowling Green Cruize-Ins" and "Corvetter Cruises" to understand that, sports-car heritage aside, the vast majority of buyers are older men looking for something to wax, keep miles off, drive gingerly and show off on the weekends, and to that demographic a soft automatic makes a lot of sense. In the end as long as it helps GM sell a lot of them it benefits me because I'll be able to get what I want for cheap.
Right now I have a 600rwhp Shelby GT500 with a manual tranny, I love to drive the manual tranny, but if it were offered I would buy an automatic for the track and light to light prowess.
As long as it had paddle shifters so I could play around on the street for regular cruising I would be happy.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 3,098
Likes: 301
From: North shore,Ma./Naples Florida
This argument will go on for a long time. There are some that will buy the auto and hone it in for racing performance and squeezing every second they can at the track. There are some that just can't drive a stick well enough to get much out of it. And there are those, probably in the majority who are just too lazy to shift.
Here is a quote from a couple years ago from Ranger, who few people here doubt his knowledge and ability to drive, and who sums it up nicely.
" For many owners, the C6Z06 is their first experience behind the wheel of a manual-tranny super car. Seat time needs to accumulate before driver reactions are honed. Even then, on the drag strip, turning AH down or off gives all risk and no reward.
Finally, I note with interest your car has an automatic tranny. Easier to drive, spared of the need to work the clutch and shifter and manage shift-points. That makes for less congestion in the driver's central processor, freeing up cycles to enjoy the view and play with the radio. "
Ranger
Here is a quote from a couple years ago from Ranger, who few people here doubt his knowledge and ability to drive, and who sums it up nicely.
" For many owners, the C6Z06 is their first experience behind the wheel of a manual-tranny super car. Seat time needs to accumulate before driver reactions are honed. Even then, on the drag strip, turning AH down or off gives all risk and no reward.
Finally, I note with interest your car has an automatic tranny. Easier to drive, spared of the need to work the clutch and shifter and manage shift-points. That makes for less congestion in the driver's central processor, freeing up cycles to enjoy the view and play with the radio. "
Ranger
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,076
Likes: 0
From: Lake Forest CA
Reply
This argument will go on for a long time. There are some that will buy the auto and hone it in for racing performance and squeezing every second they can at the track. There are some that just can't drive a stick well enough to get much out of it. And there are those, probably in the majority who are just too lazy to shift.
Here is a quote from a couple years ago from Ranger, who few people here doubt his knowledge and ability to drive, and who sums it up nicely.
" For many owners, the C6Z06 is their first experience behind the wheel of a manual-tranny super car. Seat time needs to accumulate before driver reactions are honed. Even then, on the drag strip, turning AH down or off gives all risk and no reward.
Finally, I note with interest your car has an automatic tranny. Easier to drive, spared of the need to work the clutch and shifter and manage shift-points. That makes for less congestion in the driver's central processor, freeing up cycles to enjoy the view and play with the radio. "
Ranger
Here is a quote from a couple years ago from Ranger, who few people here doubt his knowledge and ability to drive, and who sums it up nicely.
" For many owners, the C6Z06 is their first experience behind the wheel of a manual-tranny super car. Seat time needs to accumulate before driver reactions are honed. Even then, on the drag strip, turning AH down or off gives all risk and no reward.
Finally, I note with interest your car has an automatic tranny. Easier to drive, spared of the need to work the clutch and shifter and manage shift-points. That makes for less congestion in the driver's central processor, freeing up cycles to enjoy the view and play with the radio. "
Ranger
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 41,732
Likes: 1,718
From: Springfield MO
I keep hearing about this Ranger legend & his driving ability's I wonder how his clutch, transmission & valve spring budget goes. The Zo6 & Zr-1 both have a history of trans problems just driving them normal. From a mechanical stand point an auto is easier on the drive train & on something called a warranty. No one not even he can out shift an auto that would be important to someone like myself who is an old drag racer.Living here in Calif. how much fun is a clutch & in my case being 6'6" with long legs getting stuck in traffic . So from a practical point of view unless your brain is stuck back somewhere in time when there weren't any good automatics it doesn't make much sense to have to deal with a clutch.
Believe me when I say a "good" driver could shift his 4 speed Muncie, with a Hurst shifter, faster than an automatic. Popularity of the automatic in drag racing came about when they introduced "bracket" racing where consistency is the key, not quickness.
I don't believe there is anyway I could shift my C6 Z06's manual transmission anywhere as fast I could shift my Muncie's back in the 60's, thus my quickest 1/4 times today would be driving an automatic.
There have been many improvements in factory stock automatic transmissions, but I don't believe todays manual transmissions can be shifted as fast as the manual transmissions of 50 years ago.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 3,098
Likes: 301
From: North shore,Ma./Naples Florida
Yes I think this ongoing debate is interesting and while I have always opted for the Manual and never considered an auto, the jury would be out for the first time with me on this new Z06. If I ordered today sight unseen, I would of course order the stick because I love shifting, but I would strongly consider the auto if it indeed performs as well as expectations and is still fun to drive. For me, that would take driving one of the new tranny's first.
Other than that I have no problem with the choice being offered or anyone's choice to go one way or the other. It's all good.
Other than that I have no problem with the choice being offered or anyone's choice to go one way or the other. It's all good.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,076
Likes: 0
From: Lake Forest CA
Reply
Times have changed from the golden" years of drag racing. Back in the 50's & 60's when there were "stock" classes, there were different classes for the automatics from the manuals. The "good" racers(ones that held the national records)were slower in their automatics than their counterpoints with their manuals. The manuals held the advantage.
Believe me when I say a "good" driver could shift his 4 speed Muncie, with a Hurst shifter, faster than an automatic. Popularity of the automatic in drag racing came about when they introduced "bracket" racing where consistency is the key, not quickness.
I don't believe there is anyway I could shift my C6 Z06's manual transmission anywhere as fast I could shift my Muncie's back in the 60's, thus my quickest 1/4 times today would be driving an automatic.
There have been many improvements in factory stock automatic transmissions, but I don't believe todays manual transmissions can be shifted as fast as the manual transmissions of 50 years ago.
Believe me when I say a "good" driver could shift his 4 speed Muncie, with a Hurst shifter, faster than an automatic. Popularity of the automatic in drag racing came about when they introduced "bracket" racing where consistency is the key, not quickness.
I don't believe there is anyway I could shift my C6 Z06's manual transmission anywhere as fast I could shift my Muncie's back in the 60's, thus my quickest 1/4 times today would be driving an automatic.
There have been many improvements in factory stock automatic transmissions, but I don't believe todays manual transmissions can be shifted as fast as the manual transmissions of 50 years ago.
Racer
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 299
Likes: 110
From: Northern California
I keep hearing about this Ranger legend & his driving ability's I wonder how his clutch, transmission & valve spring budget goes. The Zo6 & Zr-1 both have a history of trans problems just driving them normal. From a mechanical stand point an auto is easier on the drive train & on something called a warranty. No one not even he can out shift an auto that would be important to someone like myself who is an old drag racer.Living here in Calif. how much fun is a clutch & in my case being 6'6" with long legs getting stuck in traffic . So from a practical point of view unless your brain is stuck back somewhere in time when there weren't any good automatics it doesn't make much sense to have to deal with a clutch.
I totally agree. I too am an old retired drag racer who was very well know for my seamless abilities with the manual 4-speed on the strip. I would have never given an automatic a second thought back then, but along came the Lenco "Automatic" transmission and OMG! I thought I died and went to heaven. No more clutch issues and high maintenance I may add and no more broken gear boxes, even though they were built specifically to take it. It was expensive to purchase at the time, but well worth every penny. Oh! BTW, the C7.R...... Are those paddle shifters I see those drivers using in the video's?
Last edited by tmcternan; Apr 23, 2014 at 02:16 PM.
Drifting
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,274
Likes: 75
From: Fairfield County, CT
If GM can even achieve 80% of the performance of the "Sport" PDK in the GT3 and Turbo it will be a huge success. Those boxes are far and away better than any other DCT I've driven.
Here is an interesting tidbit...BMW is building the M231i Racing club racer with an 8-speed torque convertor paddle-shifted auto in it rather than a DCT. Interesting times...
S.
Here is an interesting tidbit...BMW is building the M231i Racing club racer with an 8-speed torque convertor paddle-shifted auto in it rather than a DCT. Interesting times...
S.
Scraping the splitter.
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 8,111
Likes: 1,029
St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15
They haven't said they won't be sold in the US, but that BMW has no "firm plans" and if there is a demand they may.
Neat stuff...Porsche does the same thing with the Cayman, but my point with this was that BMW is using an 8-speed torque convertor auto.
Based on my experience with my C7 A6 on track, GM will have to work very hard to control temps to allow the Z06 to run anything more than 10-15 minutes of hard lapping.
S.
Racer
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 299
Likes: 110
From: Northern California
Times have changed from the golden" years of drag racing. Back in the 50's & 60's when there were "stock" classes, there were different classes for the automatics from the manuals. The "good" racers(ones that held the national records)were slower in their automatics than their counterpoints with their manuals. The manuals held the advantage.
Believe me when I say a "good" driver could shift his 4 speed Muncie, with a Hurst shifter, faster than an automatic. Popularity of the automatic in drag racing came about when they introduced "bracket" racing where consistency is the key, not quickness.
I don't believe there is anyway I could shift my C6 Z06's manual transmission anywhere as fast I could shift my Muncie's back in the 60's, thus my quickest 1/4 times today would be driving an automatic.
There have been many improvements in factory stock automatic transmissions, but I don't believe todays manual transmissions can be shifted as fast as the manual transmissions of 50 years ago.
Believe me when I say a "good" driver could shift his 4 speed Muncie, with a Hurst shifter, faster than an automatic. Popularity of the automatic in drag racing came about when they introduced "bracket" racing where consistency is the key, not quickness.
I don't believe there is anyway I could shift my C6 Z06's manual transmission anywhere as fast I could shift my Muncie's back in the 60's, thus my quickest 1/4 times today would be driving an automatic.
There have been many improvements in factory stock automatic transmissions, but I don't believe todays manual transmissions can be shifted as fast as the manual transmissions of 50 years ago.