Camber Adjustment Maxed Out
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Dec 2005
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From: Pawleys Island, SC
Team Owner
Joined: May 2001
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From: Western NY
Got new bushings coming today. Crossing my fingers that's the problem. Then I can address the yoke issue later. Tire wear is the least of my worries. An extra 1/2 degree neg camber isn't going to do much over the 2k - 3k miles I'll put on over the season. I'll update when I get a chance to get the bushings swapped out, few days maybe.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,164
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From: Pawleys Island, SC
I'm still not seeing how a lousy 3/16" of yoke wear is using up all of the strut cam adjustment. A little trig tells me that would require pulling the strut in about 5/32" to maintain camber. There's a lot more adjustment than that built into the strut/cam adjustment.
Last edited by revitup; May 2, 2018 at 01:23 PM.
Team Owner
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From: Western NY
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2015
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From: NSW, Australia
C3 of Year Finalist (track prepared) 2019
I'd drive it for the season and just keep an eye on the diff to ensure the yokes don't start eating the housing. -1 degree will have minimal if any impact on tyre wear, and will only make the handling better (though the side yoke play will make it worse!). I run between -1 and -1.5 camber on the rear of my car.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,164
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From: Pawleys Island, SC
I wonder if the side yoke play is what makes my handling a little "darty". Gymkhana with 255/60s and Bilstein HDs all around. It handles pretty well in 'normal' driving but spirited corners and lane changes (WOT passing) usually requires a small course correction after the quick turn or quick lane change. Not really sure what 'oversteer' is, maybe this is it? If the yoke play isn't involved in this maybe this is a subject for another post.
Last edited by revitup; May 6, 2018 at 03:21 AM.
Team Owner
Joined: May 2001
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From: Western NY
With that much "play" in the suspension, the rear camber is changing every time the "inner" rear tire unloads, when cornering.
One other thing to consider, is that as those side yokes are moving in and out, what's stopping them, inside the differential, is the shaft that the spider gears rotate on. This shaft locates in two holes in the carrier. If this shaft sees enough beating and banging, it will elongate those holes, and then you'll be looking at a replacement carrier.....
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Racer
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From: Lehigh Valley Pennsylvania
Thanks, the bushings are easy. If you're referring to the yoke issue, yeah, seems like a lot of work.
I'm still not seeing how a lousy 3/16" of yoke wear is using up all of the strut cam adjustment. A little trig tells me that would require pulling the strut in about 5/32" to maintain camber. There's a lot more adjustment than that built into the strut/cam adjustment.
I'm still not seeing how a lousy 3/16" of yoke wear is using up all of the strut cam adjustment. A little trig tells me that would require pulling the strut in about 5/32" to maintain camber. There's a lot more adjustment than that built into the strut/cam adjustment.
Every time you turn from right to left that shaft is going from being pushed in to pulled out (or vise versa depending upon the side) You may delude yourself into thinking you have the camber set, but 10 ft down the driveway it will be different.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,164
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From: Pawleys Island, SC
You do realize that you have two pivot points to set camber. You are buying all new bushings for the one so it doesn't move more than a few hundredths of an inch and the other one you are saying 3/16" doesn't matter.
Every time you turn from right to left that shaft is going from being pushed in to pulled out (or vise versa depending upon the side) You may delude yourself into thinking you have the camber set, but 10 ft down the driveway it will be different.
Every time you turn from right to left that shaft is going from being pushed in to pulled out (or vise versa depending upon the side) You may delude yourself into thinking you have the camber set, but 10 ft down the driveway it will be different.
Every time you turn from right to left that shaft is going from being pushed in to pulled out
Race Director
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From: Plano TX
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,164
Likes: 224
From: Pawleys Island, SC
You do realize that you have two pivot points to set camber. You are buying all new bushings for the one so it doesn't move more than a few hundredths of an inch and the other one you are saying 3/16" doesn't matter.
Every time you turn from right to left that shaft is going from being pushed in to pulled out (or vise versa depending upon the side) You may delude yourself into thinking you have the camber set, but 10 ft down the driveway it will be different.
Every time you turn from right to left that shaft is going from being pushed in to pulled out (or vise versa depending upon the side) You may delude yourself into thinking you have the camber set, but 10 ft down the driveway it will be different.
You are buying all new bushings for the one so it doesn't move more than a few hundredths of an inch and the other one you are saying 3/16" doesn't matter.
Team Owner
Joined: May 2001
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From: Western NY
I didn't say the 3/16" yoke play didn't matter. It obviously does. I only said that there should be enough adjustment in the strut cam to compensate for a yoke that is only 3/16" inboard in a static condition (like it is when I'm adjusting it and the car is sitting in my garage). I have no doubt that the yoke play allows camber to vary a bit when driving and cornering.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Dec 2005
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From: Pawleys Island, SC
I hate to keep "piling it on", but you're overlooking that GM designed the rear suspension to work, WITHIN CERTAIN LIMITATIONS, limitations that are determined by new, UN-WORN parts. Shove the upper suspension link (the half-shaft, as attached to the yoke) in another 3/16", and you're now WAY outside of the design specification. Therefore, the rear camber cannot be correctly set, until the yokes are either replaced, or reworked to OE length.
Race Director
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From: Charlotte NC
I was going to jump in but 'zwede' and 'leadfoot4' said all that needs to be said on this.
As for 1/8" to 3/16" of wear on the side yokes...it might as well be a mile.
And installing the adjustable strut rods that give you more adjustment possibilities...is only masking the MAJOR problem that has been discussed here.
DUB
As for 1/8" to 3/16" of wear on the side yokes...it might as well be a mile.
And installing the adjustable strut rods that give you more adjustment possibilities...is only masking the MAJOR problem that has been discussed here.
DUB
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,164
Likes: 224
From: Pawleys Island, SC
I was going to jump in but 'zwede' and 'leadfoot4' said all that needs to be said on this.
As for 1/8" to 3/16" of wear on the side yokes...it might as well be a mile.
And installing the adjustable strut rods that give you more adjustment possibilities...is only masking the MAJOR problem that has been discussed here.
DUB
As for 1/8" to 3/16" of wear on the side yokes...it might as well be a mile.
And installing the adjustable strut rods that give you more adjustment possibilities...is only masking the MAJOR problem that has been discussed here.
DUB
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2009
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From: Charlotte NC
Only because the countless customers I have had that have the same exact issue as you...and do not understand why putting in new strut bushing in the factory strut rods will not do anything at all. Once they understand the dynamics at play..and they do not want to deal with the costs of the obvious side yoke wear. So...some opt out of the 'adjustable strut rod fix' that will correct the camber issue ...but still do not want to deal with the side yoke wear.
It is no different than people using the off-set upper control arm shaft to aid in correcting the obvious problem of the cradle collapsing inwards.... which directly effects how the camber/caster can be set for the front end alignment....and those people choose to use the off- set upper control arm shaft instead of getting the car on a frame machine and pulling the cradle back into correct specs.
DUB
It is no different than people using the off-set upper control arm shaft to aid in correcting the obvious problem of the cradle collapsing inwards.... which directly effects how the camber/caster can be set for the front end alignment....and those people choose to use the off- set upper control arm shaft instead of getting the car on a frame machine and pulling the cradle back into correct specs.
DUB