Do I have it wrong?
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 7,475
Likes: 2
From: Austin TX
St. Jude Donor '07
Originally Posted by Mr Mojo
That was a fact. When the C5 was being developed, two of the goals were lower cost and lighter weight. It was accomplished in both cases.
As far as C4's outperforming, there wasn't a single C5 that beat me at the track. The first one to do so was a 2001 and only by a hundreth of a second.
Your results may vary.
As far as C4's outperforming, there wasn't a single C5 that beat me at the track. The first one to do so was a 2001 and only by a hundreth of a second.
Your results may vary.
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 12,221
Likes: 446
From: Overland Park Kansas
2020 Corvette of the Year Finalist (appearance mods)
C4 of Year Winner (appearance mods) 2019
When they built the C4, aerodynamics, performance, mileage, and emissions were major concerns. Their were other goals but primarily, it was an engineering feat. It was an exercise in engineering -- more than styling. As recently described, the early C4 is a rolling doorstop. But the drag coefficient, cornering, and performance characteristics were king in it's era. So, it's not a bad thing!
The later C4's worked on improving HP and styling. Because HP ratings seemed so low and because sports car enthusiasts want power, the early C4's got a bad rap. Part of that was due to changes in HP rating methodology. (This applies to late C3s as well). I also think part of the appeal issue was due to the straight body style. Compared to earlier vettes, they weren't curvey anymore!
The C5 brought curves back. And, the car became more practical (storage, ride, etc...). The main reason I didn't like a C5 at first was it's lineage seemed too "Euro". As a euro clone, it lost the label (and looks) of an AMERICAN sports car! Still, the C5's appearance has grown on me.
The C6 is back to being an exercise in engineering. If styling was important, it would look much different than the C5. In the department of performance and engineering, the C6 is a hit. In the department of styling, I can't say that. So, I would conclude that your difference in perception depends on whether you like the Corvettes PRIMARILY for their styling or for performance. (That concludes the passionate part of my point. Next comes practical)...
All Corvettes depreciate before they go back up in value. The ones that eventually increase are being restored, customized, are well-kept collector cars, etc.... They don't increase by magic! A worn out car will rarely raise in value. But, a new car will always have it's attraction. Right now, the late C3/early C4 era probably represents the low in Corvette value (depreciation) vs. the older cars that are being restored (with lots of $$$). That's probably the reason for the OP's perception. And, it's really true.
Ask the same question in 20 years. The C5's and C6's will probably be at the bottom. (Nah, they have too much HP for that).
-Gregg
The later C4's worked on improving HP and styling. Because HP ratings seemed so low and because sports car enthusiasts want power, the early C4's got a bad rap. Part of that was due to changes in HP rating methodology. (This applies to late C3s as well). I also think part of the appeal issue was due to the straight body style. Compared to earlier vettes, they weren't curvey anymore!
The C5 brought curves back. And, the car became more practical (storage, ride, etc...). The main reason I didn't like a C5 at first was it's lineage seemed too "Euro". As a euro clone, it lost the label (and looks) of an AMERICAN sports car! Still, the C5's appearance has grown on me.
The C6 is back to being an exercise in engineering. If styling was important, it would look much different than the C5. In the department of performance and engineering, the C6 is a hit. In the department of styling, I can't say that. So, I would conclude that your difference in perception depends on whether you like the Corvettes PRIMARILY for their styling or for performance. (That concludes the passionate part of my point. Next comes practical)...
All Corvettes depreciate before they go back up in value. The ones that eventually increase are being restored, customized, are well-kept collector cars, etc.... They don't increase by magic! A worn out car will rarely raise in value. But, a new car will always have it's attraction. Right now, the late C3/early C4 era probably represents the low in Corvette value (depreciation) vs. the older cars that are being restored (with lots of $$$). That's probably the reason for the OP's perception. And, it's really true.
Ask the same question in 20 years. The C5's and C6's will probably be at the bottom. (Nah, they have too much HP for that).
-Gregg
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Feb 1999
Posts: 321
Likes: 0
From: Det.Mi.U.S.A.
Hello,
Mojo, you just made me think "how many people beat the hell out of a Vette on a test"? I remember going to check out a Vette once, a 76 (didnt really like those much as far as buying) and the owner wouldnt let me drive it. He said that you wouldnt believe how people had gotten into his car and beat his car to death. I kinda understood, but I didnt see how anyone would buy a Corvette that they had not driven.
BTW thanks for the story.
MDred85
Mojo, you just made me think "how many people beat the hell out of a Vette on a test"? I remember going to check out a Vette once, a 76 (didnt really like those much as far as buying) and the owner wouldnt let me drive it. He said that you wouldnt believe how people had gotten into his car and beat his car to death. I kinda understood, but I didnt see how anyone would buy a Corvette that they had not driven.
BTW thanks for the story.
MDred85
Racer
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 461
Likes: 0
From: ilion ny
Originally Posted by TopSpeedC4
Wow, this is quite the thread going.... glad to see the spirited debate, and by-and-large everyone getting along.
Cars are a personal thing. Sports cars are a very personal thing. I was 20 years old when the '86 Pace Car came out with the droptop after being gone for 10 years. One look was all it took for me, I fell head over heels in love with the car. I love almost each and every Corvette, there is no such thing as a bad one really. But, the '86 Pace Car left a spot on my soul that could only be remedied by eventually owning one.
20 years I waited. 20 years, not a day went by that I didn't think of it. I had a couple real nice Camaro's, a killer Nova, and a bunch of beaters, but each day passed and all I could think of was getting one. It became an obsession almost. My wife and I bought this Mustang GT that had a few goodies on it, as a stop-gap method of at least keeping me in a muscle car. I really didn't enjoy it much. I always compared it to the Vette. We sold it soon after, it just didn't drive my passion any.
Then, another couple of "normal day-to-day" cars came to our driveways, but I hated them. I hated spending money on repairs on a car that I did not like. Again, comparing them to the Vette.
My 40th birthday came up this July, and my beloved wife said to me, "Maybe it's time to just go for it. It means so much to you, let's not leave this planet without that experience." I was overwhelmed with joy.
We spent 8 weeks looking. I did all the research on the internet that I could. We drove several, most of them lacking in one area or another that mattered to us. Within short order, we realized we were looking for one very specific car. A 1987 Roadster, preferrably red.
Each day shopping, my heart ached. I did not know if we could find our beloved car, I did not know if when we DID find it, could we afford it? I had almost given up hope there for awhile... until.
I opened up Auto Trader online one afternoon, and there she was.... the exact, precise, to the letter, car we were so desperately searching for. Everything was as it should be. She's red. She's a convertible. She's got the L98 that I fell in love with some 20 years before.....
Now, our car needs attention in some small areas; common problems really. We are planning on genuinely loving and cherishing every moment of finding the parts, getting it fixed, and enjoying the outcome.
Every day I go to work now, my heart is filled with absolute joy. The kind of joy a 5 year old has when he sees his favorite toy under the tree Christmas morning. This car has shown me that I haven't grown up, and in all actuality, have no plans to do so anytime soon.
I get all sorts of reactions from people. Mostly, young kids stop dead in their tracks and point and talk when they see us go by. Some people are not impressed.
I could not care one iota. We have our dream car, in every form of the term, and absolutely nothing is going to take away this feeling. I sincerely hope you all have a similar experience with your cars. They truly are the Greatest Sports Car in the World, in my opinion, and nothing gives me greater joy than sharing my love and enthusiasm with anyone else who might be interested.
Cars are a personal thing. Sports cars are a very personal thing. I was 20 years old when the '86 Pace Car came out with the droptop after being gone for 10 years. One look was all it took for me, I fell head over heels in love with the car. I love almost each and every Corvette, there is no such thing as a bad one really. But, the '86 Pace Car left a spot on my soul that could only be remedied by eventually owning one.
20 years I waited. 20 years, not a day went by that I didn't think of it. I had a couple real nice Camaro's, a killer Nova, and a bunch of beaters, but each day passed and all I could think of was getting one. It became an obsession almost. My wife and I bought this Mustang GT that had a few goodies on it, as a stop-gap method of at least keeping me in a muscle car. I really didn't enjoy it much. I always compared it to the Vette. We sold it soon after, it just didn't drive my passion any.
Then, another couple of "normal day-to-day" cars came to our driveways, but I hated them. I hated spending money on repairs on a car that I did not like. Again, comparing them to the Vette.
My 40th birthday came up this July, and my beloved wife said to me, "Maybe it's time to just go for it. It means so much to you, let's not leave this planet without that experience." I was overwhelmed with joy.
We spent 8 weeks looking. I did all the research on the internet that I could. We drove several, most of them lacking in one area or another that mattered to us. Within short order, we realized we were looking for one very specific car. A 1987 Roadster, preferrably red.
Each day shopping, my heart ached. I did not know if we could find our beloved car, I did not know if when we DID find it, could we afford it? I had almost given up hope there for awhile... until.
I opened up Auto Trader online one afternoon, and there she was.... the exact, precise, to the letter, car we were so desperately searching for. Everything was as it should be. She's red. She's a convertible. She's got the L98 that I fell in love with some 20 years before.....
Now, our car needs attention in some small areas; common problems really. We are planning on genuinely loving and cherishing every moment of finding the parts, getting it fixed, and enjoying the outcome.
Every day I go to work now, my heart is filled with absolute joy. The kind of joy a 5 year old has when he sees his favorite toy under the tree Christmas morning. This car has shown me that I haven't grown up, and in all actuality, have no plans to do so anytime soon.
I get all sorts of reactions from people. Mostly, young kids stop dead in their tracks and point and talk when they see us go by. Some people are not impressed.
I could not care one iota. We have our dream car, in every form of the term, and absolutely nothing is going to take away this feeling. I sincerely hope you all have a similar experience with your cars. They truly are the Greatest Sports Car in the World, in my opinion, and nothing gives me greater joy than sharing my love and enthusiasm with anyone else who might be interested.
similar story here with me loved the vette sence i first layed eyes on one my fav is a 78 indy pace car i drool over that one. ill be 30 on thanksgiving and just bought my first vette this past summer an 84 auto with the crossfire engine and 43,000 miles. now i would prefer a lil more ponies under the hood and a standard but hell what i dont like i can fix and i really like making my car something different then the majority anyways. so i ended up spending some $ on a zf6 and clutch pedals and a carbon fiber driveshaft and so on and so on with plans of a zz383 to go along with it. yes i know i coulda gotten a newer car with a zf6 and at least alot closer to the hp #s of the zz383 then the crossfire but i couldnt pass up the deal i got on this 84. even though it sits in my driveway undriven yet i still love it cause its mine and boy i cant wait to get behind the wheel and take off. and this comes from a guy who loves a c3 and growing up said damn those c4s are ugly compared to c3s but somehow as i guess it always does the c4 kinda grew onto me. i bet the same will be said down the road about those c5s and imo i like the looks of the c5 and c6.
Elite Torch Red Member
Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 57,805
Likes: 23
From: Exit 89 GSP,Lakewood,NJ The Land Of Mojo
Cental/South NJ Events Coordinator
CI 1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10-11-12 Vet
CI-II Burnout & Drag Champ
St. Jude Donor '03-'04-'05-'06-'07
Originally Posted by VetteUSA
Not to discount what you're saying, but it's not just the car, it's ultimately the driver that determines the race.
It was Chris from ECS who finally beat my best time in his 2001. As far as the other races, well, reaction time certainly plays a part on getting to the finish line first, but the ET's also show something as well.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 844
Likes: 8
From: Butler PA
I could'da had a C5 instead of my Ruby, but after test driving several C5's and C4's, I went with the C4. For me (I'm from the old school of sports cars) the C4 is a ground pounding, hard charging, bend-your-body-outta-shape, flat out brute. That's what I like. The C5 had too much of that refined out of it. Now, I'm not disputing the performance numbers of the C5 mind you, just that the C4 stirs my sports car blood, and C5 doesn't. Sports cars should hurt. They should at times, be scary, hairy beasts.
Just my $.02 worth.
Just my $.02 worth.
Heel & Toe
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 23
Likes: 0
I'm new to this forum, just bought a '95 C4. Sounds like some kind of explosive and in fact it is. Just lovin' it. First surprise: I'm told that Corvettes are old man's cars! Wow where have I been? The kids are buying rice rockets, not Corvettes.
I don't get this rivalry on the Forum. Looked at a few C5's today and THEY LOOK SHARP! I'm OK with all the Vettes, the're way COOL. Let's all be happy with what we have. Fact: GM DID NOT kill the Corvette. My car needs ball joints so last night I slipped in a Beach Boys CD into Veteroni's player in the garage and was VERY HAPPY!!!! You be happy too, whatever you're drivin.'
I don't get this rivalry on the Forum. Looked at a few C5's today and THEY LOOK SHARP! I'm OK with all the Vettes, the're way COOL. Let's all be happy with what we have. Fact: GM DID NOT kill the Corvette. My car needs ball joints so last night I slipped in a Beach Boys CD into Veteroni's player in the garage and was VERY HAPPY!!!! You be happy too, whatever you're drivin.'
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Instructor
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 236
Likes: 0
From: Hudson FL
I love my C4 but I have driven a friend's C5, and it rocked !!!!. *** kickin power...
I have a buddy (my mechanic) who's had c4, c5 and c6 and says his c6 is pure thunder and precision balance, he says the car is so balanced you have trouble breakin all that power loose. Best combination of power and suspension, getting power to the ground he's seen yet.
Every generation had something to offer !!!!
I had a Chevy tech tell me that I should sell my C4 because they were a nightmare to work on. He said God help you if you gotta ever do a Climate Control Module, you gotta rip half the car apart. Said if one of those jobs come in I take the week off.
I wasnt very happy about my opti/WP job I just had to do but...
But I love my 94 6spd polo coupe.
I would say if I had the bucks I have at least one of every generation !!!!
I have a buddy (my mechanic) who's had c4, c5 and c6 and says his c6 is pure thunder and precision balance, he says the car is so balanced you have trouble breakin all that power loose. Best combination of power and suspension, getting power to the ground he's seen yet.
Every generation had something to offer !!!!
I had a Chevy tech tell me that I should sell my C4 because they were a nightmare to work on. He said God help you if you gotta ever do a Climate Control Module, you gotta rip half the car apart. Said if one of those jobs come in I take the week off.
I wasnt very happy about my opti/WP job I just had to do but...
But I love my 94 6spd polo coupe.
I would say if I had the bucks I have at least one of every generation !!!!
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 5,198
Likes: 10
From: Homestead Fl
St. Jude Donor '06-'07-'10-'11-'12-'13-'14
C4's are really just as fast as you make them. Agent86, Corvette Kid, bogus, Central Coaster and countless others are always telling me how they do it. Check out our neighbors in the Forced Induction / Nitrous section. They just might have a clue. All I can say is both my Corvettes are worth every penny I have into them and then some. Enjoy the ride...............
............
............
Racer
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 393
Likes: 0
From: Palm Springs CA
It doe seem to get a bad rap, but not from me. I have a 95 as it was the car available when I was out looking. I of course would take a C5 if they were handing them out. But I still like the C4 best, I think it looks best. And the 84-90 style has grown on me also, they look very nice when well maintained and I think with the round taillights they may have more of a purest Corvette than the 91-96. As far a performance goes, for there day I think they where just like the ZR1 says (King of the road). As Mojo has proven you can outrun a C5 if you know how to drive. I have always thought its the driver, and the guts to drive it. Of course the way he has driven the C4 I am certain he would be hard to beat in a C5 also. My 2 cents. C4'S rule. I wish instead of some of the retro's the companies have build, they would have designed the new Corvettes to lokk more like a C4, but will all the new technolgy, now that would be a car.
Drifting
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 1,743
Likes: 0
From: Ohio
Go the C5 for sale page and take a look at what they are going for. A low mileage C5 will go for $20-25K. That's pretty good resale.
Drifting
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 1,743
Likes: 0
From: Ohio
The early style C4 looks great in a convertible. The rear end isn't bubbly like all newer vettes.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 843
Likes: 0
From: Albany Oregon
Hello,
It seems to me that not only are C4 Corvettes the least respected of the family, but the early C4s are the least of that least. The early C4s seem to be the only early gen models to get slammed even within their own gen. I really like my 85 and have for 10 years. I don't pretend that it is better than an LT any more than a Ferarri 308 owner would say his is better than a 328.
So friends tell me . Do I have it wrong?
MDred85
It seems to me that not only are C4 Corvettes the least respected of the family, but the early C4s are the least of that least. The early C4s seem to be the only early gen models to get slammed even within their own gen. I really like my 85 and have for 10 years. I don't pretend that it is better than an LT any more than a Ferarri 308 owner would say his is better than a 328.
So friends tell me . Do I have it wrong?
MDred85
I consider all C4's to be my brothers-in-arms. I love the C5 and lust for one....It will be my next car
On the other hand....the C3's body style gives me Big Bamboo!!!
Always has....but I've never even sat in one.
Just wave to 'em all! Better ANY Corvette than a dern Easy-Peasy-Japanesey!!!!
