Requesting brake help....again.
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 76
Likes: 0
From: Austin TX
Requesting brake help....again.
I have brake problems that I can't seem to fix. Thanks for listening:
Problem:
Front brakes get (very) hot even on a short ride because the calipers don't disengage fully.
Probably related, the brakes are very creaky when I come to a full stop.
What I've done so far:
New brake lines (stainless steel)
Replaced the front calipers (refurbished)
Replaced the booster (refurbished)
Replaced the master cylinder (refurbished)
Bled the brakes more times than I can count
Please offer some ideas on what I should do about this problem because the front brakes are getting HOT
, I mean RED HOT after a typical drive. I can't even touch the wheels because they get very hot too...
I have a feeling that I'm going to have to re-replace one of the components listed above & I'd like to know which one I should start with or how I can trouble-shoot to try to figure out what is going on.
Should I be buying new components instead of refurbished? Upgrade to a non-c4 oem brake system?
Thanks for your help...again
Problem:
Front brakes get (very) hot even on a short ride because the calipers don't disengage fully.
Probably related, the brakes are very creaky when I come to a full stop.
What I've done so far:
New brake lines (stainless steel)
Replaced the front calipers (refurbished)
Replaced the booster (refurbished)
Replaced the master cylinder (refurbished)
Bled the brakes more times than I can count
Please offer some ideas on what I should do about this problem because the front brakes are getting HOT
, I mean RED HOT after a typical drive. I can't even touch the wheels because they get very hot too...I have a feeling that I'm going to have to re-replace one of the components listed above & I'd like to know which one I should start with or how I can trouble-shoot to try to figure out what is going on.
Should I be buying new components instead of refurbished? Upgrade to a non-c4 oem brake system?
Thanks for your help...again
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 5,874
Likes: 0
From: Littleton CO
Originally Posted by lachrimae
I have brake problems that I can't seem to fix.
How are the caliper brackets? If it is warped a bit, maybe the caliper binds. If there are bad surfaces - worn, corroded, painted - where the pads rest, it could cause some sticking. However, it does seem an unlikely cause for both sides to do this at once, as your post seems to indicate.
Pads installed correctly, with the anti-rattle springs on the bottom?
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,621
Likes: 206
From: Orlando FL
The actuator rod from the booster might be out of adjustment. If it is to long it will depress the masters piston and activate the brakes. Unbolt and pull back the master. Check the length of the rod. It should be approximately just below the imaginary surface line of the booster. It needs approximately 1/8 inch of clearance to the master due to heat expansion of the parts.
When adjusting the rod end bolt, the rod had to be held and the nut turned, in to shorten. I clamp the rod with thin vice grips VERY LIGHTLY and adjust nut. Depress the brake pedal half way down to get the rod out in the open so it can be worked on easily.
Jack the front up before you start and check to see if anything is dragging. Then unbolt the master and see if it releases. After adjusting (if necessary) the rod, re-check brakes pedal and wheel rotation. Might take a few tries
When adjusting the rod end bolt, the rod had to be held and the nut turned, in to shorten. I clamp the rod with thin vice grips VERY LIGHTLY and adjust nut. Depress the brake pedal half way down to get the rod out in the open so it can be worked on easily.
Jack the front up before you start and check to see if anything is dragging. Then unbolt the master and see if it releases. After adjusting (if necessary) the rod, re-check brakes pedal and wheel rotation. Might take a few tries
Last edited by pcolt94; Nov 28, 2006 at 02:06 PM.
Thread Starter
Advanced
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 76
Likes: 0
From: Austin TX
How are the caliper brackets? If it is warped a bit, maybe the caliper binds
Good question. They don't appear to be off but I don't have a tool to measure them to a precise degree. I will consider replacing them since they are still original.
Pads installed correctly, with the anti-rattle springs on the bottom
Yes
Did you replace the pins when you replaced the calipers? Lube them with appropriate grease? Did you replace the pads?
Yes to all, thanks.
pcolt94, I will take a stab at the booster adjustment and try to isolate the sticking problem as you suggest by testing the caliper lockup before and after releasing the MC.
Thanks for all of your posts, I will keep you updated (probably late tonight).
Good question. They don't appear to be off but I don't have a tool to measure them to a precise degree. I will consider replacing them since they are still original.
Pads installed correctly, with the anti-rattle springs on the bottom
Yes
Did you replace the pins when you replaced the calipers? Lube them with appropriate grease? Did you replace the pads?
Yes to all, thanks.
pcolt94, I will take a stab at the booster adjustment and try to isolate the sticking problem as you suggest by testing the caliper lockup before and after releasing the MC.
Thanks for all of your posts, I will keep you updated (probably late tonight).
Race Director
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 12,182
Likes: 1
From: Partying with the Cowboys cheerleaders in Mt. Olive, New Jersey
Originally Posted by pcolt94
The actuator rod from the booster might be out of adjustment. If it is to long it will depress the masters piston and activate the brakes. Unbolt and pull back the master. Check the length of the rod. It should be approximately just below the imaginary surface line of the booster. It needs approximately 1/8 inch of clearance to the master due to heat expansion of the parts.
When adjusting the rod end bolt, the rod had to be held and the nut turned, in to shorten. I clamp the rod with thin vice grips VERY LIGHTLY and adjust nut. Depress the brake pedal half way down to get the rod out in the open so it can be worked on easily.
Jack the front up before you start and check to see if anything is dragging. Then unbolt the master and see if it releases. After adjusting (if necessary) the rod, re-check brakes pedal and wheel rotation. Might take a few tries
When adjusting the rod end bolt, the rod had to be held and the nut turned, in to shorten. I clamp the rod with thin vice grips VERY LIGHTLY and adjust nut. Depress the brake pedal half way down to get the rod out in the open so it can be worked on easily.
Jack the front up before you start and check to see if anything is dragging. Then unbolt the master and see if it releases. After adjusting (if necessary) the rod, re-check brakes pedal and wheel rotation. Might take a few tries
Check the actuator rod.
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Thread Starter
Advanced
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 76
Likes: 0
From: Austin TX
Update: I adjusted the actuator rod (only once so far) and have noticed a big improvement so thanks for your advice!
I recall reading other posts in the past concerning adjusting the rod too far where it may create a dangerous situation (no brakes
). The service manual shows a GM part that helps to nail down the "go" and "no go" adjustment levels for the rod... have any of you used it or do you just adjust to where it is just able to fully release the calipers?
I recall reading other posts in the past concerning adjusting the rod too far where it may create a dangerous situation (no brakes
). The service manual shows a GM part that helps to nail down the "go" and "no go" adjustment levels for the rod... have any of you used it or do you just adjust to where it is just able to fully release the calipers?
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 174
Likes: 3
From: Yorba Linda CA
Here are a couple of threads which maybe of help to you.
One by pccolt94 http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show...r+actuator+rod
as he has the best description on how to do this that I've run across and is far more eloquent than I am. Note: This is on lengthing rather than shortening the rod but the procedure is the same.
This is another thread I saved with a lot of good info. http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show...r+actuator+rod
I particularly liked the idea of edcmat-l1 of cracking the bleed screw to see it that further retracted the caliper. Also see Hot Rod Roy's "squirt" test.
Sounds as though you are on the right track...Hang in there!
One by pccolt94 http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show...r+actuator+rod
as he has the best description on how to do this that I've run across and is far more eloquent than I am. Note: This is on lengthing rather than shortening the rod but the procedure is the same.
This is another thread I saved with a lot of good info. http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show...r+actuator+rod
I particularly liked the idea of edcmat-l1 of cracking the bleed screw to see it that further retracted the caliper. Also see Hot Rod Roy's "squirt" test.
Sounds as though you are on the right track...Hang in there!
Racer
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 418
Likes: 45
From: Houston Texas
Had a '91 Ford Taurus with same problem (Teenage son recently sent this car to the graveyard...I pretended to be upset). Only the fronts were affected, and one front wheel got so hot once it melted the plastic hubcap.
None of the Ford dealers could/would fix it, and I noticed that the pedal was not coming back up all the way (probably only about 3/4 back). I was coasting downhill once and reach up under the brake pedal with my toe and pulled the pedal all the way up.....brakes that were dragging now released!
I put a small hardware store spring on the brake pedal to pull the pedal up all the way. Why it did not do it by itself, I don't know. But, we went thru all the usual suspects...change pads, calipers, rotors, fluid, etc etc.
If this was my C4, I would want to fix it correctly, but on that car, it was just one thing after another. So, if you're looking for a simple solution, check if the pedal is coming back all the way.....
Good Luck.
None of the Ford dealers could/would fix it, and I noticed that the pedal was not coming back up all the way (probably only about 3/4 back). I was coasting downhill once and reach up under the brake pedal with my toe and pulled the pedal all the way up.....brakes that were dragging now released!
I put a small hardware store spring on the brake pedal to pull the pedal up all the way. Why it did not do it by itself, I don't know. But, we went thru all the usual suspects...change pads, calipers, rotors, fluid, etc etc.
If this was my C4, I would want to fix it correctly, but on that car, it was just one thing after another. So, if you're looking for a simple solution, check if the pedal is coming back all the way.....
Good Luck.
Race Director
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 13,911
Likes: 101
From: Manassas VA
NoVa Events Coordinator
St. Jude Donor '14
Originally Posted by pcolt94
The actuator rod from the booster might be out of adjustment. If it is to long it will depress the masters piston and activate the brakes.