Complaining about being pulled over doesn't necessarily make one guilty of some infraction Tact. Did it occur to you that one might complain about being pulled over and yet be innocent of the charge? Guilty until proven otherwise? I didn't think it worked that way here in the good ol' US of A.

 

Anymore you can get in trouble for thinking about doing something, not actually doing it at all. Instigating a race, isn't that like "being kind of pregnant"? The police need to do their job.

 

They were.

Street racing kills people. That is EXACTLY why it is not even allowed to be told in story format here.



Cops have a code of ethics they follow. They are sworn to it, by choice. It is not forced upon them, they want to do the job right. They go into the profession to uphold the law, not break it. I know there's a few bad apples, just like in any human factor in the world, but cops do not make $hit up just to pick on you! If you don't think the violation was that severe then so be it, but it obviously was an infraction none the less.

 

Most (not all) cops are fvcking idiots.

 

They were not racing. They pulled up to the light and revved up the engines. That is not racing. That may look like they were going to race but they did not. If they had actually raced then by all means, ticket them. Don't ticket them for something they did not do. How can you "instigate" a race without a race?

How? They did not race. Here is my take on this for what it's worth and I know that is not much. There was a law on the books that made street racing illegal. The cops were either too lazy or too preoccupied driving up and down the roads at 90 mph with no lights or sirens on to catch people racing so they whined and whined that it should be easier for them to ticket people. So laws were passed that said that if you give the "appearance" that you might race, you can get a ticket for that. What is next? Lets ticket all drivers of fast cars because their cars are "capable" of racing. If the police would do their jobs and catch people ACTUALLY racing then we would not need these stupid petty laws. Before you ask, I have never had a speeding or parking ticket in my life. I don't speed so I am not saying this stuff because I am pissed off at the cops for giving me tickets.

 

Yeah, pretty crazy stuff. Unsuccessful instigating then lowers to attempted instigation? Which holds a slightly lower penalty of course...


Where I don't agree with this entirely, I’d say it’s a rather common perception, and very unfortunate. Here is another case of "Perception is Reality" leading to an unjust categorizing of something, LEOs in this case, equally as undeserved and unjust as my Perceived street race instigation...


Dan

 

Cops are just like everyone else, they're human and make mistakes like the rest of us. So it's not inconceivable to think that the cop made a mistake in thinking they were street racing, or were getting ready to street race. Maybe there was some doubt in that cop's mind and that's why he didn't write LF97C5Vette up. For that I can salute what that cop did (or in this case, what he didn't do).

 

You 'n me both! LOL


Dan



I also just wanted to point out in case there was any confusion, that i'm not complaining about this incident. No harm no foul - just discussing some of the new laws, and perceptions about street racing...

 

Road rage is the result of escalating hostilities. Reminds me of something said in another thread that I finally unsubscribed from to help keep my blood pressure down. People were complaining because a pedestrian motioned a driver to slow down. Many of the responses were that the pedestrian should have been flipped off. One person said, and I'm paraphrasing, "why should he get away with making that motion and I shouldn't be able to flip him off, that's not fair."

We have this attitude that "fairness" involves "getting even with that so-and-so." That's where road rage comes from. He cut me off, so I'm going to flip him off... He flipped me off, so I'm going to swerve towards his car... he swerved towards me so I'm going to get in front and slam on my breaks... he stopped in front of me so I'm going to get my gun and shoot him... because then "we'll be even and it'll be fair."

At any rate, and back on topic, street racing is a problem, and it needs to be stopped. But I also agree that if there was no race then one cannot be ticketed for "instigating" a race. This was most likely a situation where the cop felt a message needed to be delivered, and that's what he did. The bottom line is, no harm, no foul, and the OP now knows what is and is not acceptable in that jurisdiction.

 

Sure it has happened but the majoity of people that are pulled over have violated some sort of law, otherwise the stop was unlawful. Most of the people who get stopped still complain when they know they were guilty. 99.9% of the police don't pull drivers over just to harass them. Again, that's not saying that it doesn't ever happen.

 

Obviously you've not had very good experiences with the police. You've got a lot to learn; and I'm sure it will be learned the hard way.

 

No no, this is partly true... I watched a show on the discovery channel about this. I don't remember all of it, but one thing that made an impact was being able to see the other persons face. If shopping and someone accidentally pulls out in front of you and it surprises them, so they give you a nod of apology, you feel better seeing they’re sincere about their mistake. However, on the road if someone cuts you off, you pull along side them and they don't even care, or didn't even notice. You tend to get angrier and want revenge. (This is where what Craig is talking about comes in: Escalating Hostility) Of course, this isn't always the case; it was just one factor in the show where they went into great detail about road rage.

And Craig, I was in that thread you’re ‘paraphrasing’ and I was the first person in the thread to mention the word “Fair” so I can only assume you’re trying to paraphrase me. Might I suggest then reading my post again w/ lower blood pressure, because when I said “Is that Fair” it had nothing to do with getting even, instead it was a rhetorical question about whether or not it is ok if I didn't smile… lol

Back on subject for me... lol ( hijaking my own thread?? WTF? )



Dan

 

I think you handled things well under the circumstances...that's why you didn't get the ticket!

 

So if someone is pulled over and ticketed yet commited no traffic violation, which you admit can happen, and I think does happen more than just the 0.01% of the time you implied it did, then do you think he has no right to complain? I know about this from personal experience. Many years ago, my brother and I were heading home from college for a weekend visit when a car passed us doing probably 15 mph faster than we were going. It should have been obvious who the speeder was but guess who the cop pulled over? The other guy kept on going and my brother got the ticket for the other guy's speeding violation (my brother wasn't doing anywhere near the speed the cop said he was). We tried telling that to the cop but he wouldn't listen, probably because we were college-age kids so it had to have been us who were speeding. The point of this story is that cops make mistakes just like the rest of us, they aren't infallible, in fact probably make more mistakes than they would want to admit to.

 

You need to get out of the house more often.

 

I never said cops don't make mistakes, we're only human like everyone else. Mistakes can happen but my comment was regarding people who complain even when they know what they were stopped for. If I was ticketed and I honestly thought I was ticketed by fault of the police officer, I'd fight it in court with tooth and nail.
You obviously took my post out of context. Go back and read it again.

 

Back in the day we raced every weekend. Like 20-30 of us on the farm to market road, never ever ever had an accident or even came close. We had guys driving out full blown 9 second race cars out to the farm to market and had one guy trailer a dragster out. Most of the time everyone had been drinking some beers and we had a blast. So street racing can be relatively safe if everyone knows the deal and you hit a road less traveled with no homes on it. We have those for miles and miles of nothing. Ever raced back in reverse after running forward a 1/4?? WooHoo!!

disclaimer: Do Not Street Race cause it is against the law and you can lose your license and car.

Point being the penalty conbined with officers discretion is realy a bit unfair. I happen to think the seat belt law is unfair though. Is this Communist China? I don't need anyone to tell me what I need to do to keep me safe. I have insurance to cover me should I get hurt or killed so I don't understand the whole click it or ticket deal at all. Thats the rules though so your either gonna play or your gonna pay.

One thing that was mentioned earlier though was about police running 95-110mph weaving in and out of traffic just to catch up to and pull over a car that was running 4mph over the posted limit. This has happened to me several times and really gets my goat. Especially when they whip in behind you like a maniac. I've slammed on my brakes before when they've done that and cause them to swerve into the ditch to avoid me. I acted like nothing happened and suprized they had to go around me and motion me forward. (I did not get a ticket then, they knew they shouldn't be pulling that stuff) I've done the same on a motorcycle but thinking back it probably wasn't the smartest thing to do since i could have been seriously injured but what the heck, i was a bit ticked off at the irresponsibility toward the rest of the motoring world while trying so hard to catch me, 5 mph over the limit woohoo..

I understand some police just do their job and try to be polite but I must live in the part of the country that gets em just out of academy and they are mostly all overcocky turds, 90% are HWY Patrol. The few I know and get along with are the older police that aren't out to prove anything. If i'm in the wrong then hey, you got me, i'll pay the fine and move on but in the process when they feel it's OK to drive recklessly it makes me wonder what makes them any different?

Maybe some of you law enforment guys can enliten us. Are you taught it's ok to drive like a maniac to catch to someone who is just barely runnin gover the limit? I kid you not, the second day I had this vette (5 weeks ago) I was puled over for going 59 in a 55 on the main 4 lane hwy 1/8 mile passed the speed change sign from 65 to 55, still in the country but just inside the city limits, no houses, no businesses, nothing but a 4 lane hwy and cotton fields. I didn't even see the sign. Makes me wonder do you guys take any opportunity to pull someone over to check em out? What about pulling ppl over for a license plate light being out and it's not out. Just another excuse? Thats happened to me alot also. Makes us feel like it's just an abuse of power.

You can't outrun the radio but you can outrun the car with the radio and consequencly his los so by the time another officer blocks the road you've already turned off and no one knows abou it. Do not take this the wrong way folks. Running from the law is dead serious stuff and you can get into serious trouble not to mention hurt someone else so don't do it. It can be done though.

 

I agree, sounds like you met a cool LEO. You have got to eliminate blame and except personal accoutability. See it through his eyes.

 

Oh yea,,, Back - in - the - day..............
Can't you think of some other remotely possible thing to say? Why would a cop have to do anywhere near 110 mph to catch up to someone doing "4 over"? If the speed limit is 55 and your doing "59" (is that before you see the officer or after when you automatically lift your right foot and tap the brakes before looking down at your speedo) why would they have to double your speed? It doesn't make sense, and is just a lame bash.
Then when you get the ticket for stopping without a reason (careless driving) then you'll be back on here B****ING again about how UNFAIR things are in your town, or how the rookies pick on you.
Me no lookey so you must be lying officer....
Oh yea,, here's a GREAT idea. Challenge the "reckless cops who will do anything and everything to stop me, even drive mach 25 when I'm doing 1mph over the limit when I didn't see the sign". I'm sure the few nights in jail you spend will be worth the lame attempt to outrun every cop around you. Hopefully you have prepaid legal or a huge savings account to pay for the lawyer you will need if you ever decide to try out your own suggestion.