You realize this problem plagues all C5 vettes, 97 thru 04!

 

After a summer of bull**** and replacing everything except the BCM I replaced the part I suspected in the first place. The ignition lock cylinder, it's been flawless ever since.

 

Errr... where did you get that idea? I never said anything like that. No wonder this thread got so askew. I was talking about automatics, as the original poster of this thread has an automatic!

Try re-reading the original post, then re-read MY original post. That might clear things up for you. I guess there's no point in addressing the rest of your post, now that I know you thought I was talking about 6-speeds all this time. I was wondering why you kept using exclamations and emphasizing text so much. That must've been frustrating for you. All I was trying to point out with my original post was that disabling the CL mechanically may not be the best route because the computer is still programmed to check status of the lock, which leaves room for error in the system that would render a car undriveable, whereas a CLB on even an automatic might be the better choice.

Interestingly, now that the original poster says GM thinks it was the BCM, maybe this whole deal is moot, though I doubt it. Because, even more interesting is the fact that quite a few people have been told their BCMs were bad when they had these symptoms AFTER the recall was done, and were subsequently charged for replacement of their BCMs. Based upon what you and I have BOTH been saying about the CL motor still being able to operate and fail in the locked position, and the computer seeing that locked state and therefore disabling the car, I think GM may be trying to cover their tracks by "diagnosing" the problem as a BCM. I wouldn't be surprised because this way, they don't have to pay the dealer, and they don't have to deal with chaos, should news leak that the latest recall for automatics doesn't even address the CL-bug issue. Can you imagine what would happen, then? YIKES!

 

Understood. I will only add that when you say "mechanically disabling the stock C.L.", that may mean one thing to you (or me) and something else to someone else. My breakdown goes like this:

Only removing the locking plate from an A4 = useless. No, technically the car's steering column cannot lock while doing 80 PMH on the freeway, which is really all GM cares about, but it doesn't address the core issue.

Removing the plate and installing a "Harness K", a.k.a. "GM approved" CLB, now you are on to something. (Although the only reason you’d remove the plate is if you didn't manually retract the CL (assuming it still functions) like you would in the CLB installation; Maybe GM figured this was "too complicated" for their techs to handle; who knows (or cares).

Sorry if I got excited. Don't take it personally. It's just that it seemed you were getting a bit bogged down in all of this "it's so complicated, that's why GM still can't fix the issue", etc. It's not that it's so complicated, it’s that the real fix would be to re-design the stock C5 C.L. motor assembly, and install it in 40,000 cars. Can you imagine how expensive that would be!

So to summarize; the only solution for MM6's and A4's is an aftermarket CLB, or the GM version (Harness K). I did notice from a pic that the Harness K device appears to have two sets of connectors. You really only need to have a singe 4-wire connector. I wonder if (for some reason) they are still feeding the stock C.L. power. If they are, I'm sure it is only energizing it to the "unlock" position. But you could manually unlock it and not connect the second connector. (Jeez, that sentence sounds crappy!)

 

Are we on the same page? After all that ? All's well that ends well, I guess, huh?

Anyway, yes, seems to me the CLB (including the HarnessK) is really the only solution...for now, I guess.

I personally think somebody went WAAAAAYYYY overboard with the computerization of the C5. I mean, when you think about it, they should've known computerizing the steering lock was in fact an attempt at making a better moustrap. But, why, is the question. Mechanical steering locks worked for ages. What could they possibly have gained by computerizing the thing? To able to say the whole car is computerized? Or was it someone who wanted the overtime?

 

You folks are scaring me. I am considering getting a C5 and I have to admit this thread really ticks me off. Help me with some perspective here.

This can happen to any year C5? (I believe I saw the answer was yes...bummer!)
How often does this happen? (I have to believe this is somewhat rare)
Once you do get the problem, there seems to be no real fix? (ie...from GM...)

Don't feel it necessary to post to this....maybe this forum does need a sticky post about this issue...and the above are some 'newbie' questions.

My two cents

Brian

 

Hey, Brian,

Yep, ANY year C5, and up until very recently, we all thought the latest recall GM has out now for all C5s at least addressed the automatics. Until reports of computer disablement of the fuel system (part of the recall's new computer program that prevents you from driving with a locked column) due to column lock system errors showed up even on cars that had part of the locking mechanism removed, so the steering CAN'T lock (a specific recall action performed only on automatics - don't ask).

This is NOT as rare as you might think. I used to think these guys on here were on drugs, and that it was INDEED a rare thing, and considering how many folks out there own C5s, I chalked it up to so many reports because of the sheer numbers. Until I saw the dreaded message on my own '01 6 spd. in July.

I was lucky, though, and the column wasn't locked, at least I don't think it was. I simply pulled the key, wiated 10 seconds, then re-inserted it. The message appeared again, I about took a sh|t! The third time was the charm, though, and I didn't see it since, but, I lost sleep over it, because I knew then that the folks on the forum weren't exaggerating.

Then, the recall was released, and I was relieved. I took my car in and had the recall done. While there, I read the bulletin, and discovered nothing the campaign called for was going to alleviate the problem. When I got home that day, I ordered a CLB.

I recommend ANYONE does the same thing... or goes and buys a foreign sports car instead.

 

I HAVE a foreign sports car...and every car has it's own personality issues. Looking forward to the day when I can say that I USED to have a foreign sports car.

Thanks for the clarifications. At least there is a fix for this. Where does one find one of these CLB's?...Are they easy to install? Just curious...

 

Then get a C5 with a CLB.

Corvettes of Houston have the cheapest price I've seen. Small unit, easy to install and works. Pull off the lower piece of the dash plastic, plug the unit in as per the instructions (very simple, but extremely important two-step process needs to be done is a specific sequence) and you're done.

Oh wait, you have a foreign car...hmmm, that means you've probably never had to work on it Ok, in that case we can provide you with all the instructions, including photos, already up on the web.

 

Leadfoot-

Quite the opposite. It is a 1979 Porsche 928 and I am always working on it. It was fun for awhile but something about 25 year old fuel injected, pollution controlled cars just seems to get a little tiring. The poor old beast has left me stranded 4 times but is just what happens when a car gets that old. It is just too cost prohibitive to replace in masseverything that could potentially shoot you (and it is so much more fun to do that one by one...UGH).

The 928 was always a dream car and now that I have that out of my system, time for the next dream car. I have to believe that the C5 will be light years beyond the 928 in reliability...that is until I read this thread!

Brian

 

Its hard to fathom that GM has still not really fixed this problem.

 

Well, I posted this WAY back on page two of this thread......
MYBLU71, I've got one suggestion that might help you. Since you're going back under the dash anyway (If you're like me you've become an expert at removing the lower panel) Why don't you disconnect the Harness from the CL side. OneTexDog and I both left the CL side of the harness disconnected and our "Pull Key" message has not returned. You can always reconnect it if (a)The mesage comes back or (b)You miss seeing the message on your DIC
If you do this, you might see it the first time you start the car, but hopefully that will be the last.

 

Well Guys, I decided to wait until it finally broke solid... The "Service Column Lock" message was now staying on fulltime!!!

Took it to another dealer that was highly recommended by a well-know performance builder in the Atlanta area. I had the Service Writer and two Technicians verify that they could see the "Service Column Lock" message on the DIC before I left.

Got a call and they tell me that the column lock relay and a reduced locking ring will resolve the messages. They also tell me that there is a computer software upgrade that has been available for a number of months!!! Why didn't the other dealers do that while they had it???!!!

The parts and labor are going to be $431. + tax and the programming will cost another $83.39!!

I am on the phone(on perpetual ignore) waiting to reopen my claim and see if they will cover the parts THEY installed into MY car!

I will update you when I know more.

 

I see this thread is still alive..

Unless you have an A4, no amount of parts GM throws at your car will fix this issue, PERIOD. And neither will any software reprogramming.. That software update only protects GM from lawsuits.. It doesn't do jack for you and your stranded car. If you do have an A4, and *if* they install the recommended parts (Harness-K / remove locking plate from steering column) you'll be all set. GM will *not* install a Harness-K to a 6-speed, or any other device that disables the steering lock. Ain't gonna happen, don't bother asking. This is the reason GM will *never* truly fix 6-speeds. The original issue (this goes for ALL C5's) is the design of the stock CL motor / assembly. It's under-engineered, will not last over the "long haul"; it's *not* a software problem. Having GM re-flash your 6-speed's PCM only helps them, not you.

What you can do (if you have a 6 speed or an A4) is buy the GM Harness-K (basically a GM-designed CLB). It's about 75 bucks. Either that, or buy the aftermarket version. Either way you are getting ripped-off, since it's only a 10 dollar component; I know, because I built and installed my own CLB, works flawlessly. Anyone w/ a high-school level of education in electronics can do the same. Knowledge is power, and $$.

 

So, Dan, can you do a writeup detailing how I might make my own CLB?

 

I agree with Dan it's not going away until they replace the column lock itself if it's not working. That's on a 6 speed. Or you put a CLB into replace the CL once it's fixed. Can't put a CLB onto a non-functioning CL. Good luck and I think GM should replace the CL free since it's their blunder.
I was just thinking if there's a lawyer out there wants to start a class action suit maybe GM would acknowledge the problem. After all if there was nothing wrong with the CL they wouldn't be putting the harness K into the A4. And since it's the same CL in the 6 speed they are responsible for them too. My .02

 

You aren't the first CF member to ask.. And I'll respond w/ the same as I have the others.. I won't because it will potentially "short sheet" JimX and others who give their time and money to the CF community, with little return, other than selling items like the CLB. I will give you a hint.. CLB's contain a single component; a magnetic-latching relay..

 

GM's indifference to the problem is unreal - just ordered my CLB kit, taking no chances.

 

Well, the final results on my 00 vert with the A4 tranny is that they had to replace the column lock relay/harness that was part of the harness/relay that was installed as part of the recall. They also installed a reduced diameter locking ring and the messages have disappeared.... for now.

The programming was not needed as it was already in the car, but not on GM's computer system as being updated.

And get this,... GM actually picked up the cost of the repairs! that restored a small amount of faith in the "squeaky wheel" theory.

The thing that was the most telling about the relay, for me, was that when I turned the key on, I never heard the relay/motor kick in to pull back the pin from what would have been the locking plate. now it is...

I love my vert, but more of these types of issues and I am going to put it up for sale... Glad I also have a 1971 vert that doesn't have all of this computer crap in it...

Just wanted to let everyone know what happened.

 

Well I don't think your done! I have a friend with an A4 and you don't hear the CL retracting or engaging. It's not supposed to after the recall. Afterall that's what they are doing is disabling the CL so it won't lock on you. If you hear it and your steering locks and your unable to turn the wheel after turning the car off. They didn't get it right. Most here don't plug the CL into the harness K once the harness is installed and the CL has retracted. My .02