Help ... False Hot Engine?
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 779
Likes: 2
From: Bloomingdale Illinois
I'd bet you have trouble getting any heat out of the heater. I believe the purpose of the second disc is to seperate the heater send and return water passages, thus forcing water through the heater. The Robertshaw type allows hot water to "short circuit" the heater.
I have all the heat I want. Not that I ever need it.
Yes you are correct on the 2 stage design. It will give you heat sooner by letting the water go through your heater core before the second stage opens to cool the engine.
When you run a Meziere electric water pump you have to run this kind of thermostat, the oem will not fit. It is also relocated to the upper waterpump nipple instead of the one going to the lower hose like OEM.
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Perry
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Melting Slicks
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,216
Likes: 4
From: ---Phoenix, AZ --- Boiler Up, Hammer Down!
I have the car modded one of which is the 160 t'stat. The weird thing is when you start the car, for a split second, the gauge shows what I would expect to be the actual coolant temp but then the gauge settles down to zero with the Hot Engine message. Very strange.
I'll have it looked at this week (if the problem persists) and will post up any results.
I'll have it looked at this week (if the problem persists) and will post up any results.
I disconnected the battery to clear it and all is fine. However this morning (59F outside) I let the car idle to 172F before leaving which took 10 minutes
. Once I started driving the temp dropped down to as low as 158F. I didn't get the message this time...but tomorrow may be another story.Spoke to Chuck CoW who tuned my car and I may put my stock stat in for the winter and switch back in late March/April to the 160 T-Stat when it starts to get warm.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 260
Likes: 0
From: Holbrook NY
Just had the HOT ENGINE/TURN AC OFF message yesterday afternoon here in PHX with temps around 65F. I have the 160 stat and the car never got above 155F and then the message appeared and the fan ran nonstop of course.
I disconnected the battery to clear it and all is fine. However this morning (59F outside) I let the car idle to 172F before leaving which took 10 minutes . Once I started driving the temp dropped down to as low as 158F. I didn't get the message this time...but tomorrow may be another story.
Spoke to Chuck CoW who tuned my car and I may put my stock stat in for the winter and switch back in late March/April to the 160 T-Stat when it starts to get warm.
I disconnected the battery to clear it and all is fine. However this morning (59F outside) I let the car idle to 172F before leaving which took 10 minutes
. Once I started driving the temp dropped down to as low as 158F. I didn't get the message this time...but tomorrow may be another story.Spoke to Chuck CoW who tuned my car and I may put my stock stat in for the winter and switch back in late March/April to the 160 T-Stat when it starts to get warm.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,216
Likes: 4
From: ---Phoenix, AZ --- Boiler Up, Hammer Down!
I think if you put in the right t'stat and have Chuck tune your parameters, you can go with the 160 all year. He will likely tweak the fan operating curve and also turn off the parameter that gets screwed up by a slow warm up. It is cold here now and I have no problems any more with my new, stock type 160 t'stat and the tuned parameters. Why bother with the hassle of swapping t'stats every 6 months?
Driving to work the coolant settles to 158F after reaching a high of 167-172F...that's pretty cold.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 2,670
Likes: 134
From: merritt island fl
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I had Chuck tune my car with my 160 t'stat last month. I really don't want to ship my PCM to Chuck since he already tuned the car. I will see how it turns out over the next few days. If I get this message again I will either put in the stock t'stat (until April) or purchase a new/different 160 t'stat and see if that makes a difference.
Driving to work the coolant settles to 158F after reaching a high of 167-172F...that's pretty cold.
Driving to work the coolant settles to 158F after reaching a high of 167-172F...that's pretty cold.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,216
Likes: 4
From: ---Phoenix, AZ --- Boiler Up, Hammer Down!
Just recieved PM's from two guys who had their cars tuned with mine last month and they are running higher temps. I plan on buying a LPE 160 T-stat to see if that works. Driving around with a 158F coolant temp doesn't seem right
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Race Director
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 11,733
Likes: 15
From: SC
Buy one of CoW's 160 t-stats and you'll be set.
Former Vendor
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 11,792
Likes: 255
From: Ossining New York
St. Jude Donor '07-'08-'09-'10-'12-'13-'14
I just thought of something....
IMPORTANT!
I just thought of something....It happened a few years ago to me....
We shipped a stat to someone who ultimately had a similar problem...We ship out tons of 160's and they are all the same...
There is ABSOLUTELY NO REASON that LIVING IN HOT ARIZONA that your temps shouldn't be higher...expecially when EVERYONE ELSE ON THAT TRIP is running perfectly.
HERE'S THE DEAL: REMOVE THE STAT and check the paddle or spring loaded washer on the bottom....I've seen when they get bent or out of shape from shipping or improper installation.
AGAIN, I have seen it once or twice and it will exhibit EXACTLY the same symptom as the "OLD SMALL BLOCK CHEVY STAT TRICK" which has caused sooo many other guys trouble. If the paddle on the bottom is bent it will not seal against the inner hole of the waterpump causing the same problem.
Please remove it, and inspect it closely and send me a pic if necessary....
I've just bent it flat and it works fine.... If that dosen't work for you I'll send you another unit....
The problem MUST be in the stat, but I would expect something like that.....
Keep me posted, but please have a close look at it.....
Chuck CoW
Melting Slicks
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,216
Likes: 4
From: ---Phoenix, AZ --- Boiler Up, Hammer Down!
I had the exact problems your having (just read through this thread) With Chucks 160 t-stat it run constantly in the 180's-190's now with the cold weather. Been out in 20 degree weather without any issues, my coolant temp is steady.
Buy one of CoW's 160 t-stats and you'll be set.
Buy one of CoW's 160 t-stats and you'll be set.
I think my stat might be the problem
. Others have told me theirs run around the same temp as yours.IMPORTANT!
I just thought of something....It happened a few years ago to me....
We shipped a stat to someone who ultimately had a similar problem...We ship out tons of 160's and they are all the same...
There is ABSOLUTELY NO REASON that LIVING IN HOT ARIZONA that your temps shouldn't be higher...expecially when EVERYONE ELSE ON THAT TRIP is running perfectly.
HERE'S THE DEAL: REMOVE THE STAT and check the paddle or spring loaded washer on the bottom....I've seen when they get bent or out of shape from shipping or improper installation.
AGAIN, I have seen it once or twice and it will exhibit EXACTLY the same symptom as the "OLD SMALL BLOCK CHEVY STAT TRICK" which has caused sooo many other guys trouble. If the paddle on the bottom is bent it will not seal against the inner hole of the waterpump causing the same problem.
Please remove it, and inspect it closely and send me a pic if necessary....
I've just bent it flat and it works fine.... If that dosen't work for you I'll send you another unit....
The problem MUST be in the stat, but I would expect something like that.....
Keep me posted, but please have a close look at it.....
Chuck CoW
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Former Vendor
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 11,792
Likes: 255
From: Ossining New York
St. Jude Donor '07-'08-'09-'10-'12-'13-'14
Stupid me.....
I think my stat might be the problem
. Others have told me theirs run around the same temp as yours.I will check it if I get the error code again. Yesterday I ordered a Lingenfelter 160 T-stat as a back up for when I need to swap out. Thanks for offering to send a stat but hold on to it in case the Lingenfelter stat doesn't solve the problem
.I ws looking at your invoice last night.....and You don't even have MY stat!
Your invoice says "HAS STAT" which means I never sent you one..
Anyway...All the more reason to change it..... Like you noticed, NOBODY ever has a problem with the ones I use.....
That's why I use em!
Chuck CoW
Melting Slicks
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,216
Likes: 4
From: ---Phoenix, AZ --- Boiler Up, Hammer Down!
Stupid me....
I ws looking at your invoice last night.....and You don't even have MY stat!
Your invoice says "HAS STAT" which means I never sent you one..
Anyway...All the more reason to change it..... Like you noticed, NOBODY ever has a problem with the ones I use.....
That's why I use em!
Chuck CoW
I ws looking at your invoice last night.....and You don't even have MY stat!
Your invoice says "HAS STAT" which means I never sent you one..
Anyway...All the more reason to change it..... Like you noticed, NOBODY ever has a problem with the ones I use.....
That's why I use em!
Chuck CoW
.I will keep you posted!
Former Vendor
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 11,792
Likes: 255
From: Ossining New York
St. Jude Donor '07-'08-'09-'10-'12-'13-'14
Stat Problems
!WARNING!
Don't get burnt like ED did!
Ed thought he was getting a deal...Ed thought he was saving money....Ed thought he was getting a "REAL STAT" for his C6...
What Ed got was a problem.....Like so many other poor souls Ed purchased a "cheaper" stat which was a conventional small block chevy stat from 1970. These stats say 160....and they are...but....only work in Vettes from the 70's.... A correct stat for an LSx motor was designed to have a spring loaded paddle on the bottom where it covers a port in the back of the waterpump. When the smaller stat (from the 70's) is installed it allows too much coolant to flow behind the stat and ultimately, the car NEVER reaches proper operating temperature in cooler weather or cruising on the highway. This will result in excessive warm up time, excessive fuel consumption, poor performance, codes, misfire, and other issues.
Ed came to me today to put his tune back to stock so he could go to the dealer to find out what was wrong.....After mentioning that his coolant temp was 152 deg on the ride to the shop, I suggested changing the stat.....Guess what we found??? see the photos below.
Ed's car drove like crap...got bad gas mileage, and even misfired....Poor, Poor, DEVIL was sad.... Ed was sooo sad that he enlisted the help of three other fellas with tuning cables to help fix the problem while I was away.....
What was the outcome???? Well, we changed the stat and sent him on a ride for 10 mins with NO TUNING....When Ed returned, he said the car was fixed...no more problems.......no misfire....and ask him what the new fuel mileage is after changing only the stat....(even with 4.10's)
Truth is, after resolving his stat issue....we played with the WOT AFR for an hour and set him up to go test it out tonight......The sad part is that after getting the car to run sooo well, Ed went to play with his friends, but it turned out they weren't interested in playing after all.....I wonder why???
and ANOTHER unfortunate customers stat ordeal below
The moral of the story......
Be sure to confirm that you have an LSx stat.....
and not the old small block chevy cheapie.....
Ed is HAPPY now...This morning, he was sad.
Don't get burnt like ED did!
Ed thought he was getting a deal...Ed thought he was saving money....Ed thought he was getting a "REAL STAT" for his C6...
What Ed got was a problem.....Like so many other poor souls Ed purchased a "cheaper" stat which was a conventional small block chevy stat from 1970. These stats say 160....and they are...but....only work in Vettes from the 70's.... A correct stat for an LSx motor was designed to have a spring loaded paddle on the bottom where it covers a port in the back of the waterpump. When the smaller stat (from the 70's) is installed it allows too much coolant to flow behind the stat and ultimately, the car NEVER reaches proper operating temperature in cooler weather or cruising on the highway. This will result in excessive warm up time, excessive fuel consumption, poor performance, codes, misfire, and other issues.
Ed came to me today to put his tune back to stock so he could go to the dealer to find out what was wrong.....After mentioning that his coolant temp was 152 deg on the ride to the shop, I suggested changing the stat.....Guess what we found??? see the photos below.
Ed's car drove like crap...got bad gas mileage, and even misfired....Poor, Poor, DEVIL was sad.... Ed was sooo sad that he enlisted the help of three other fellas with tuning cables to help fix the problem while I was away.....
What was the outcome???? Well, we changed the stat and sent him on a ride for 10 mins with NO TUNING....When Ed returned, he said the car was fixed...no more problems.......no misfire....and ask him what the new fuel mileage is after changing only the stat....(even with 4.10's)
Truth is, after resolving his stat issue....we played with the WOT AFR for an hour and set him up to go test it out tonight......The sad part is that after getting the car to run sooo well, Ed went to play with his friends, but it turned out they weren't interested in playing after all.....I wonder why???
and ANOTHER unfortunate customers stat ordeal below
The moral of the story......
Be sure to confirm that you have an LSx stat.....
and not the old small block chevy cheapie.....
Ed is HAPPY now...This morning, he was sad.
STAY TUNED!
Chuck CoW
Last edited by Chuck CoW; Dec 19, 2007 at 01:26 PM.
Race Director
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 11,733
Likes: 15
From: SC
Good post Chuck, as people can read in this thread, I was one of the unfortunate souls to get the "cool" stat. When I told you I saw a max of 160 on the highway heading to CoW, you said "sounds like a t-stat issue, bet we'll find something interesting" sure enough we did.
Former Vendor
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 11,792
Likes: 255
From: Ossining New York
St. Jude Donor '07-'08-'09-'10-'12-'13-'14
Thanks.......
Good post Chuck, as people can read in this thread, I was one of the unfortunate souls to get the "cool" stat. When I told you I saw a max of 160 on the highway heading to CoW, you said "sounds like a t-stat issue, bet we'll find something interesting" sure enough we did.
Unfortunately, many people (who I permitted to use their own 160 stats to save money) ultimately had problems and they were on the internet suggesting that it was my tune.
Just like yours, Not only did I NOT sell you a stat, but when the problem surfaced, I FIXED YOURS FOR FREE...STAT AND LABOR included.
It's been a lot of wasted time, energy, and free work for me only to prove that I never did anything wrong in the first place and that my tune was SOLID.
Please nobody take offense, I just don't want anyone else getting messed up like this.....
and most of all....I don't make any money if I keep fixing peoples cars for free
STAY TUNED!
Chuck CoW
Race Director
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 11,733
Likes: 15
From: SC
Former Vendor
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 11,792
Likes: 255
From: Ossining New York
St. Jude Donor '07-'08-'09-'10-'12-'13-'14
By the way......
Hint...HINT...HINT...
We're open day after Christmas!
Chuck CoW
Race Director
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 11,733
Likes: 15
From: SC
