Originally Posted by jklarkpimp

popcorn, how bout the lg streets?????not out yet
but they had them for the c5

Originally Posted by AR Headers

headers back to back. There are too many variables. I recall the fastest C5 coupe all motor/ stock displacement, was an LG car (phil97svt) so that means LG's are faster?

Spinmonster, As a point of reference you might want to ask Phil what happened when he switched from LG's to ARH's and then tested at the track. You'll be scratching your head when you hear what the results were.

I realize that not everyone races but track testing on a road course or drag strip is the single best way to compare. ARH supplies the headers for 6 different NHRA Pro Stock teams. After they dyno test our headers to death they then go to the track to get real world results. The reason, because one is meaningless without the other.


Nick

Originally Posted by AeroJim

I agree with your conclusions and think Spin presented an objective comparison regarding The LG's power in the mid range... I'm not a drag racer so low and mid range grunt is where I want my car to live.. I can only afford to do it once so I'd like to do it right the first time!!! I ordered my LG's last week and can't wait to get them installed when I get back from vacation

Originally Posted by SpinMonster

You think because I have dyno numbers for the people who live by that type of comparison that my car wouldnt hold up in the 1/4? My car isnt just a quick street car and a loser on a track. I have my track time with other cars all of which I built myself. Spare me the 'dyno numbers dont tell the story' static. Dave at cartek drove it and said it was a 10 second car without N2O.

Hey, spare me your dyno numbers and give me full details of your ET's including weather between the before's and after's LG's and Kooks. I stand by MY opinion that dyno's dont mean squat...and no two dyno's will give the exact same results.

As far as Dennis' car running the way it does with the Kooks, who is to say the increase in TQ wouldnt shave .05 off his launch and put him at 11.09? The automatics fare better because the rpm's drop a bit more on shifts making the TQ mean more. He doesnt know and you dont either. You state you know people that had one or the other but you fall into the same I hear all the time. I dont care what one did in comparison to another car. I would only credit the same car with both headers back to back. There are too many variables. I recall the fastest C5 coupe all motor/ stock displacement, was an LG car (phil97svt) so that means LG's are faster? Of course not, so no it doenst mean Kooks are better because theyre on the fastest bolt on car.

You fall into the same and trap too. I and others do care what one does in comparison to another car...which explains why the 1/4 mile challenge here is quite popular. Not to say I am discrediting you, but for me, I dont close my eyes to comparisons to other cars.

I gained .75HP up top so I lost nothing to Kooks 1 3/4. I think we can agree that there was nothing in the results to indicate my car would do worse in the 1/4 with my new headers. I posted the results to help others who care about such things. As far as performance, I dont see why I sould limit any part on my car to just one application. My car is plenty fast and its power level would hold up with the fastest C6's N/A. My car does both and if you want to see it for yourself come by and make some friends and check out some mods other people have done. Some may be what you want and others may not be.

Sorry, for me, I cant agree whether you would do better or do worse with your LG's unless I see time slips. Everybody feels that "my car is plenty fast"...so what?


One last note, I dont know what you meant by the high flow cats and mating to a H-pipe nonsense, but my LG's are a full 3" system with metal matrix high flow cats with an x-pipe going into a 3" Z06 exhaust. What doenst LG offer? They mate to any existing exhaust system. Now you state the nod goes to Kooks because the money isnt worth paying if it doenst shave off time in the ET but you bought corsas? They dont help you in the 1/4, yet you dropped 1200 bucks for them. It seems what is important is only what is important to you and your application. Many road race guys wouldnt give up the LG's for anything. Thats important to me.

What I meant is when I called LG, they only sold the cats with the X pipe, along with the headers as a package for $1800. Kooks sells a Cat ONLY that is specifically made to fit onto my Corsa Sports H Pipe. It was a collaberation betweeen Kooks and Corsa. Therefore I spared the expense of buying an X pipe from LG (and Kooks for that matter). For you see, on the A6, the Corsa H-pipe helps reduce drone noise. So I was not about to replace my Corsa H pipe for anyone's X pipe.

????? Not that it's any of your business, but I spent $1200 on Corsa Sports cuz I thought the stock exhaust sounded like a V6 Impala and purchased it right after I bought my car. I like the SOUND of the Corsa and knew full well BEFORE buying it that it was not for a performance gain. Just say I bought a Corsa SOUND package. Very happy with my Sports. Plus I stlll get NO DRONE with my Kooks and Corsa Sport combo.

FWIW, I respect your opinion, just dont belittle other people's research/dyno numbers. Cartek makes some of the fastest vettes out there and they dyno each and every one. It does tell you something although not the whole story. You do drive on the street too, dont you?

Originally Posted by jklarkpimp

popcorn, how bout the lg streets?????not out yet
but they had them for the c5

Originally Posted by siffert

Though yours, like mine here, is just more of the same this header against that header. I simply said, FOR ME, the proof of the pudding is the ET time, not the dyno numbers. I still stand by that.

Originally Posted by welcome2try

Well, too many variables here also, what was the track conditions when you swapped headers? How much of a difference was there in Da,temps? I can't see any header on the market topping Lg's especially with the mid range Tq/grunt that the Lg's output provides. We all know Tq is king while Hp with both headers are equal. That being said, how could you ascertain that ARH headers are superior to LG'S?

Why does team corvette at 24 lemans use LG headers on the C6R GT2 class cars, they were winning race after race with Lg's..You would think they would want only the best when it comes to such a high profile race. They did their homework.

AHR, LG'S, kooks are all high quality headers. However, I would have to go with LG'S when it comes to that mid range grunt..

Originally Posted by HITMAN99

ET numbers don't mean squat by themselves, they're just numbers. Not only will ET numbers vary greatly between tracks, they will vary widely from one run to the next. They will also vary greatly because of the weather (temp, humidity, air density, wind) and the track prep.

Dyno numbers also vary, especially from one dyno to another. But the dyno numbers are corrected for atmospheric conditions, and if coolant temps are controlled, dyno results are remarkably consistent.

One notable exception to this is airflow. If you have a fresh air intake system such as a Vararam, it's hard to duplicate the airflow effects at high speeds on the dyno. There are some effective approaches to this issue, but it's not EZ.

Bottom line is that almost all professional racers rely on dyno testing AND track results, as well as other factors, to gauge performance.

Not sure what all this has to do with which headers are best. For my money, if one header consistently shows more power gains in a given RPM range on the dyno, I tend to believe that it is actually making more power. I also tend to believe that if you make more power, you're going to go faster.

Originally Posted by MarylandSpeed

I don't think comparing at the track makes a lot of sense. All the headers on the market for the Vette are very good..and there is a lot of conjecture out there over what is better than what which I am not gonna get into. That being said, there is a lot of differences between cars, tunes, and race condions to the point that it would make it almost impossible to say that one header is definativly better than the other by a decisive margin.

Saying a header brand is better than the other based on track performance is like trying to say Michael Jordan scored more points on nights he wore Hanes undies instead of Fruit of the Loom. There obviously many more things that would impact Jordan's performance on any night than his underwear. It is the same with headers.

Originally Posted by timd38

So you mean to tell me that if I buy a new Chevy Impala it won't be as fast as Jeff Gordon's?

Originally Posted by SpinMonster

You think because I have dyno numbers for the people who live by that type of comparison that my car wouldnt hold up in the 1/4? My car isnt just a quick street car and a loser on a track. I have my track time with other cars all of which I built myself. Spare me the 'dyno numbers dont tell the story' static. Dave at cartek drove it and said it was a 10 second car without N2O.

As far as Dennis' car running the way it does with the Kooks, who is to say the increase in TQ wouldnt shave .05 off his launch and put him at 11.09? The automatics fare better because the rpm's drop a bit more on shifts making the TQ mean more. He doesnt know and you dont either. You state you know people that had one or the other but you fall into the same I hear all the time. I dont care what one did in comparison to another car. I would only credit the same car with both headers back to back. There are too many variables. I recall the fastest C5 coupe all motor/ stock displacement, was an LG car (phil97svt) so that means LG's are faster? Of course not, so no it doenst mean Kooks are better because theyre on the fastest bolt on car.

I gained .75HP up top so I lost nothing to Kooks 1 3/4. I think we can agree that there was nothing in the results to indicate my car would do worse in the 1/4 with my new headers. I posted the results to help others who care about such things. As far as performance, I dont see why I sould limit any part on my car to just one application. My car is plenty fast and its power level would hold up with the fastest C6's N/A. My car does both and if you want to see it for yourself come by and make some friends and check out some mods other people have done. Some may be what you want and others may not be.

One last note, I dont know what you meant by the high flow cats and mating to a H-pipe nonsense, but my LG's are a full 3" system with metal matrix high flow cats with an x-pipe going into a 3" Z06 exhaust. What doenst LG offer? They mate to any existing exhaust system. Now you state the nod goes to Kooks because the money isnt worth paying if it doenst shave off time in the ET but you bought corsas? They dont help you in the 1/4, yet you dropped 1200 bucks for them. It seems what is important is only what is important to you and your application. Many road race guys wouldnt give up the LG's for anything. Thats important to me.

FWIW, I respect your opinion, just dont belittle other people's research/dyno numbers. Cartek makes some of the fastest vettes out there and they dyno each and every one. It does tell you something although not the whole story.

You do drive on the street too, dont you?

Originally Posted by LG Motorsports

Here is the fastes NA Corvette Coupe 10.4 @ 140mph


And here is for those who like longer runs:


When I get too old to Road Race, I am going to take up Drag Racing.

Lou G