Perception C5 vs C7
Thread Starter
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 21,325
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From: small town in S.E Pa. PA
St. Jude Donor '03-'04
I think the Camaro has always been a nice bridge car. The big problem with a Camaro is that like the Mustang, there are just too many of them around. Part of the pleasure of ownership is the exclusivity of owning a Corvette. ON any given day I can go out and not see a single Corvette, but in that same time I see 100 Mustangs and Camaros. Lots of bang for the buck and a bit more practical, but too much cookie cutter to invest 30 to 40 K in a car that everyone else has. I got my mother a brand new off the floor 69 Camaro back in 69 the cost was right around 4200 dollars. She put 9,000 miles on that car in 15 years. When she passed away we sold that car for 6000 dollars.
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,943
Likes: 4
From: Lawrenceburg KY
C7 is faster in a straight line, faster around corners, nicer inside, more fuel efficient, and more practical to drive with its smaller turning radius and better nose and tail ground clearance. The only reason I don't get one is price tag.
Complain about it being un-American all you want, it is better in every objective comparison except for Curb Weight.
But if you really think that this:
Bears any resemblance to this:
Then I have to think that perhaps it is better you aren't being paid to design cars anymore.
Complain about it being un-American all you want, it is better in every objective comparison except for Curb Weight.
But if you really think that this:
Bears any resemblance to this:
Then I have to think that perhaps it is better you aren't being paid to design cars anymore.
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 15,449
Likes: 1,716
From: Everywhere and Nowhere at all
I turn 50 next year... (49 next month) I plan to add one of these to my collection.
I am not a fan of the C7.... I too am one of the C5Z guys who will never get rid of his... It has taken me years to finally build it to suit me... From the looks, comments I get often, I would say it stands out. Just my .02
I am not a fan of the C7.... I too am one of the C5Z guys who will never get rid of his... It has taken me years to finally build it to suit me... From the looks, comments I get often, I would say it stands out. Just my .02
Thread Starter
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 21,325
Likes: 3,841
From: small town in S.E Pa. PA
St. Jude Donor '03-'04
C7 is faster in a straight line, faster around corners, nicer inside, more fuel efficient, and more practical to drive with its smaller turning radius and better nose and tail ground clearance. The only reason I don't get one is price tag.
Complain about it being un-American all you want, it is better in every objective comparison except for Curb Weight.
But if you really think that this:
Bears any resemblance to this:
Then I have to think that perhaps it is better you aren't being paid to design cars anymore.
Complain about it being un-American all you want, it is better in every objective comparison except for Curb Weight.
But if you really think that this:
Bears any resemblance to this:
Then I have to think that perhaps it is better you aren't being paid to design cars anymore.
I never once made any mention of a C7 resembling a Toyota. I never once mentioned anything negative about the technology, in fact I praised it. This thread was all about the body design and the direction GM is taking becoming a follower and not a leader. But then you would have to be able to read and comprehend what I said first, which obviously you cant.. Go to a Community college, its cheap, get some help and save your money for that C7 that's in your future. I hope the next time you put your foot in your mouth you wont look quite as bad.
Bill aka ET
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,943
Likes: 4
From: Lawrenceburg KY
Actually let's dig a bit deeper and use that reading comprehension.
E-T here lives in a small town in Pennsylvania. I've spent the past 2 years living and working in a few small towns in Pennsylvania.
Most people in small PA towns drive late model American pickup trucks, SUV's, and economy commuter sedans.
A C7 blending in in a small PA town has to either look like a pickup truck, SUV, or economy sedan. Which is it, E-T?
C7 Stingray blends right in with which of these vehicles: Ford F150, Dodge Durango, or Chevy Cobalt?
E-T here lives in a small town in Pennsylvania. I've spent the past 2 years living and working in a few small towns in Pennsylvania.
Most people in small PA towns drive late model American pickup trucks, SUV's, and economy commuter sedans.
A C7 blending in in a small PA town has to either look like a pickup truck, SUV, or economy sedan. Which is it, E-T?
C7 Stingray blends right in with which of these vehicles: Ford F150, Dodge Durango, or Chevy Cobalt?
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 15,449
Likes: 1,716
From: Everywhere and Nowhere at all
I'm an "old guy"... I agree with ET regarding the C7... It does nothing FOR ME... I think you are totally reading into things... I am sure others will agree... ET is NOT your dad... So take the whole childhood experience out of the equation and read, understand his post the way he intended it to be.
Sorry for ranting in your thread ET.... I'm moving on....
Sorry for ranting in your thread ET.... I'm moving on....
You missed the point. Old guys like that send that kind of crap out to their other old guy friends. It is frequently in all caps and riddled with spelling and grammar errors all the while they complain about stupid young people. I was forwarded one a few years ago with that exact phrase with that exact spelling by my dad and was embarrassed to know him. E-T reminds me of him very much. He spent 35+ years working at GM and misses the good old days - you know before there were black people in our neighborhood. Except he doesn't call them black people...
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 2,012
Likes: 23
From: Anaheim CA
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Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 5,814
Likes: 414
From: Pittsburgh suburbs Pa.
The first time I saw a C5 I fell in love and have since owned 3, including my current one. Simple class, unstated elegance, and a projection of power.
The C7 is just ... busy. It just has way too much going on. I have a hard time focusing in on it and figuring out what it is because there is just too much happening.
The C7 is just ... busy. It just has way too much going on. I have a hard time focusing in on it and figuring out what it is because there is just too much happening.
Sometimes they just try too hard and go overboard. They did the same thing with the TransAm back in the 80's with all of the scoops and louvers and people went for the Camaro instead with it's clean lines. I think they did the same thing with the C7, way too much in the way of creases, louvers, vents, oversized headlights, different color body panels, etc. not to mention the whole back end that looks like it belongs on something else and not a Corvette. To sum it up , just too much bling and not enough " American" muscle look in the appearance.
Drifting
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,600
Likes: 2
From: Outer banks North Carolina
Hey Evil Twin, Not to change the subject but as a designer what do you think of the 1957 corvette as far as looks? It was my favorite and I had a 57 back in 1966 which I loved. I'm not putting down the c-7 but I just don't care for the sharp angles of it. I like the lines of the c-5 and also the 63-67 coupe is one of my favorites.
I'm just an old retired mechanic and former drag car/hot rod builder but I know what I like.
p.s. I hope you get to feeling better.
I'm just an old retired mechanic and former drag car/hot rod builder but I know what I like.
p.s. I hope you get to feeling better.
Thread Starter
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 21,325
Likes: 3,841
From: small town in S.E Pa. PA
St. Jude Donor '03-'04
Frank, when children grow up and some never do. They usually say something like wow Dad you were/are a lot smarter than I ever thought your were when I was a kid. The kids in this thread are not worthy to carry our life's lesson tool bag, let alone our jock strap.
Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 5,814
Likes: 414
From: Pittsburgh suburbs Pa.
ET, I agree with you in every way . It's sad where the immaturity of some people on this forum has taken some subjects. I think it is something that's not going to change with that group of people. 
Thread Starter
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 21,325
Likes: 3,841
From: small town in S.E Pa. PA
St. Jude Donor '03-'04
Bill/E.T. I want to thank every one of YOU who made this dream machine a reality!!!
They HAVE to buy C7's....there isn't enough C5's to go around for everyone. It's been refined so much to resemble all it's other competitors....there's virtually a seamless flow from Celica to the Aztec. Which is basically how it was conceived and built by those involved with it's design. LOL.
From a Designers viewpoint if all Engineers and Designers built a car with the best attributes of all vehicles....they end up looking the same no matter which team did it. The cars in the C7 market basically all resemble each other(Viper, yada, yada, yada).
NO MISTAKING THIS.....
They HAVE to buy C7's....there isn't enough C5's to go around for everyone. It's been refined so much to resemble all it's other competitors....there's virtually a seamless flow from Celica to the Aztec. Which is basically how it was conceived and built by those involved with it's design. LOL.
From a Designers viewpoint if all Engineers and Designers built a car with the best attributes of all vehicles....they end up looking the same no matter which team did it. The cars in the C7 market basically all resemble each other(Viper, yada, yada, yada).
NO MISTAKING THIS.....
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 2,055
Likes: 864
From: So Cal
This is one of the most interesting to read threads we've had in a long time. It highlights the simple truth that people do things for their reasons, not ours. One of the most interesting things about great cars is how our likes, dislikes and prejudices evolve in the same way that our feelings for other people evolve and change.
The C7 is, like the C5 was, all about change. Big change. Change often does not go down easy. So, how any of us feels about the C7 will evolve.
I loved the C4 when it first came out, especially the ZR1. It was so groundbreaking, especially in the engine bay. Now I realize that it was a short term design. A transition if you will, that could never be a classic, similar to the Testarossa in that respect.
I did not like the C5 when it came out ... Why? Probably because it was too different ... Too big a leap, too round after an era of sharp lines. But, with time, the subtleness of the classic C5 design began to grow on me more and more.
Then I began to realize that the stance was too high and the wheels too small. Similar observations to what some are now saying about the C7. And, I agree. Both cars in their original form had distracting wheel well gaps. But, once I saw the results with lowered stances and bigger wheels and tires ... I definitely fell in love with the C5. I hope to never sell my C5 vert.
That being said, I have now been to three formal presentations on C7 design evolution. I understand that each crease and inlet has a purpose. This is not mindless bling design like a Testarossa. The C7 is quite simply an instant classic because form follows function, not the other way around.
After we saw four C7's racing around Laguna Seca in tight formation for several laps, there was an immediate awareness of what this generation of change is all about. After the ZO6 unveiling tomorrow I would hazard that there will be continuing evolution of conceptual design appreciation by more and more long time Corvette enthusiasts.
The future is here and that does not denigrate the past in any way. Obviously we cannot hide from the future by living in the past. Similarly, we cannot fervently hold onto the past as such behaviors eventually become disrespectful to the legacy.
The C7 is, like the C5 was, all about change. Big change. Change often does not go down easy. So, how any of us feels about the C7 will evolve.
I loved the C4 when it first came out, especially the ZR1. It was so groundbreaking, especially in the engine bay. Now I realize that it was a short term design. A transition if you will, that could never be a classic, similar to the Testarossa in that respect.
I did not like the C5 when it came out ... Why? Probably because it was too different ... Too big a leap, too round after an era of sharp lines. But, with time, the subtleness of the classic C5 design began to grow on me more and more.
Then I began to realize that the stance was too high and the wheels too small. Similar observations to what some are now saying about the C7. And, I agree. Both cars in their original form had distracting wheel well gaps. But, once I saw the results with lowered stances and bigger wheels and tires ... I definitely fell in love with the C5. I hope to never sell my C5 vert.
That being said, I have now been to three formal presentations on C7 design evolution. I understand that each crease and inlet has a purpose. This is not mindless bling design like a Testarossa. The C7 is quite simply an instant classic because form follows function, not the other way around.
After we saw four C7's racing around Laguna Seca in tight formation for several laps, there was an immediate awareness of what this generation of change is all about. After the ZO6 unveiling tomorrow I would hazard that there will be continuing evolution of conceptual design appreciation by more and more long time Corvette enthusiasts.
The future is here and that does not denigrate the past in any way. Obviously we cannot hide from the future by living in the past. Similarly, we cannot fervently hold onto the past as such behaviors eventually become disrespectful to the legacy.
Last edited by B747VET; Jan 12, 2014 at 01:21 PM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 2,239
Likes: 407
From: Bmore Maryland
ET, don't punch me in the face, but I disagree. When I first saw it in pictures I was "meh" attitude towards it. It wasn't until, like you, stopped at a set of lights. I then see a car turning left that took me a second to identify what it was. I was actually pleasantly surprised. It definitely has an expensive Euro look going on, but what really got my attention is the sound when it accelerated away. I suppose the fact that it was nice and sunny out and the car was clean made the body lines more clear. Really nice car. Don't get me wrong, I still love the C5 but the C7 seems like a good evolution and direction GM has taken....can't say the same for the camaro or mustang
. When I first saw it in pictures I was "meh" attitude towards it. It wasn't until, like you, stopped at a set of lights. I then see a car turning left that took me a second to identify what it was. I was actually pleasantly surprised. It definitely has an expensive Euro look going on, but what really got my attention is the sound when it accelerated away. I suppose the fact that it was nice and sunny out and the car was clean made the body lines more clear. Really nice car. Don't get me wrong, I still love the C5 but the C7 seems like a good evolution and direction GM has taken....can't say the same for the camaro or mustang
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,119
Likes: 156
From: Huntington tx
Rick, nothing on this planet looks like this...and as I've said many times, I like it. It's just on the good side of being over the top for my taste. Its like being top dead center, ( a good thing ) wound perfectly tight. Any more and it could break. like the fine strings on a violin. And there is no doubt its a C5.
I also admit to enjoying reading the younger pups and trolls take a swipe at you and your curt dealings in response.
Priceless.....
Safety Car
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 3,937
Likes: 336
This is one of the most interesting to read threads we've had in a long time. It highlights the simple truth that people do things for their reasons, not ours. One of the most interesting things about great cars is how our likes, dislikes and prejudices evolve in the same way that our feelings for other people evolve and change.
The C7 is, like the C5 was, all about change. Big change. Change often does not go down easy. So, how any of us feels about the C7 will evolve.
I loved the C4 when it first came out, especially the ZR1. It was so groundbreaking, especially in the engine bay. Now I realize that it was a short term design. A transition if you will, that could never be a classic, similar to the Testarossa in that respect.
I hated the C5 when it came out ... Why? Probably because it was too different ... Too big a leap, too round after an era of sharp lines. But, with time, the subtleness of the classic C5 design began to grow on me more and more.
Then I began to realize that the stance was too high and the wheels too small. Similar observations to what some are now saying about the C7. And, I agree. Both cars in their original form had distracting wheel well gaps. But, once I saw the results with lowered stances and bigger wheels and tires ... I definitely fell in love with the C5. I hope to never sell my C5 vert.
That being said, I have now been to three formal presentations on C7 design evolution. I understand that each crease and inlet has a purpose. This is not mindless bling design like a Testarossa. The C7 is quite simply an instant classic because form follows function, not the other way around.
After we saw four C7's racing around Laguna Seca in tight formation for several laps, there was an immediate awareness of what this generation of change is all about. After the ZO6 unveiling tomorrow I would hazard that there will be continuing evolution of conceptual design appreciation by more and more long time Corvette enthusiasts.
The future is here and that does not denigrate the past in any way. We cannot hide from the future by living in the past. Neither can we fervently hold onto the past as such behaviors eventually become disrespectful to the legacy.
The C7 is, like the C5 was, all about change. Big change. Change often does not go down easy. So, how any of us feels about the C7 will evolve.
I loved the C4 when it first came out, especially the ZR1. It was so groundbreaking, especially in the engine bay. Now I realize that it was a short term design. A transition if you will, that could never be a classic, similar to the Testarossa in that respect.
I hated the C5 when it came out ... Why? Probably because it was too different ... Too big a leap, too round after an era of sharp lines. But, with time, the subtleness of the classic C5 design began to grow on me more and more.
Then I began to realize that the stance was too high and the wheels too small. Similar observations to what some are now saying about the C7. And, I agree. Both cars in their original form had distracting wheel well gaps. But, once I saw the results with lowered stances and bigger wheels and tires ... I definitely fell in love with the C5. I hope to never sell my C5 vert.
That being said, I have now been to three formal presentations on C7 design evolution. I understand that each crease and inlet has a purpose. This is not mindless bling design like a Testarossa. The C7 is quite simply an instant classic because form follows function, not the other way around.
After we saw four C7's racing around Laguna Seca in tight formation for several laps, there was an immediate awareness of what this generation of change is all about. After the ZO6 unveiling tomorrow I would hazard that there will be continuing evolution of conceptual design appreciation by more and more long time Corvette enthusiasts.
The future is here and that does not denigrate the past in any way. We cannot hide from the future by living in the past. Neither can we fervently hold onto the past as such behaviors eventually become disrespectful to the legacy.
Well said.
Safety Car
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 3,937
Likes: 336
here is another interesting observation. " both C7's just off the showroom floor".
When I saw my first C7 it was dirty and a dark color ( which I did not like) it had the same level of dirt on it as did the other dozen cars around it. The styling was hidden behind the aftermath of a few days of terrible weather.
The reason it is so significant is the fact that My car always looks like it just came off the showroom floor. No dirt anywhere, wheel are spotlessly shiny. Not a speck of dirt on the tires, wheels, calipers or rotors, no brake dust anywhere. Rotors are so shiny they look like they were chrome plated. This all adds to the mystic about my car. It look like a brand new car to the uneducated person I meet on the street. I get lots of very positive comments daily. My paint is actually better than when I first got it. It did not . have that hand rubbed Zaino shine that it has today.
The Moral to this is my car is often mistaken for a brand new car because it looks like it just rolled off the showroom floor.
My first C7 was dirty, like all the cars around it. my eye saw a bunch of dirty cars and the C7 being a dark color did not help. That's why it didn't jump out at me. after three or 4 seconds I recognized it to be a C7 and the next thing I notice was its stance. It sat high, ( lots of ground clearance )my car sits low to the ground and I could see completely under the C7 and could see part of the car that was in the lane next to the C7 to its right. I never saw the tail lights only a broad side shot as it passed in front of me and made a sharp left hand turn.
I think the reason the encounter was so uneventful was the C7 was dark in color, dirty, with a similar high stance to the cars around it.. I think also most C5 owners I see have lowered their car and they sit very much lower and wider looking than other cars.. People I know ( not corvette people always tell me they can spot my car as mile away because it is so low and wide, and of course the torch red helps as well. Incidentally my car is not slammed.. its as low as the stock bolts will allow.
This thread is bring out my own perceptions as well as many other contributors. The Corvette is slowly loosing its American styling designs, and as an American automotive designer. this bothers me. Its not that I don't like the look of a Lambo or Ferrari, or a Bugatti or a real Saleen or any exotic. They are just not American looking. And as a Corvette guy for over 60 years, its a bit disheartening. Thanks for all the participation in this thread. Its been fun for the most part. lots of twists and turns..
C5 relevant
A little OT
Some Corvette history
Some personal taste queues
Some C7 acceptance
Some non acceptance
Some good discussions both ways.
The formula for a good thread.
When I saw my first C7 it was dirty and a dark color ( which I did not like) it had the same level of dirt on it as did the other dozen cars around it. The styling was hidden behind the aftermath of a few days of terrible weather.
The reason it is so significant is the fact that My car always looks like it just came off the showroom floor. No dirt anywhere, wheel are spotlessly shiny. Not a speck of dirt on the tires, wheels, calipers or rotors, no brake dust anywhere. Rotors are so shiny they look like they were chrome plated. This all adds to the mystic about my car. It look like a brand new car to the uneducated person I meet on the street. I get lots of very positive comments daily. My paint is actually better than when I first got it. It did not . have that hand rubbed Zaino shine that it has today.
The Moral to this is my car is often mistaken for a brand new car because it looks like it just rolled off the showroom floor.
My first C7 was dirty, like all the cars around it. my eye saw a bunch of dirty cars and the C7 being a dark color did not help. That's why it didn't jump out at me. after three or 4 seconds I recognized it to be a C7 and the next thing I notice was its stance. It sat high, ( lots of ground clearance )my car sits low to the ground and I could see completely under the C7 and could see part of the car that was in the lane next to the C7 to its right. I never saw the tail lights only a broad side shot as it passed in front of me and made a sharp left hand turn.
I think the reason the encounter was so uneventful was the C7 was dark in color, dirty, with a similar high stance to the cars around it.. I think also most C5 owners I see have lowered their car and they sit very much lower and wider looking than other cars.. People I know ( not corvette people always tell me they can spot my car as mile away because it is so low and wide, and of course the torch red helps as well. Incidentally my car is not slammed.. its as low as the stock bolts will allow.
This thread is bring out my own perceptions as well as many other contributors. The Corvette is slowly loosing its American styling designs, and as an American automotive designer. this bothers me. Its not that I don't like the look of a Lambo or Ferrari, or a Bugatti or a real Saleen or any exotic. They are just not American looking. And as a Corvette guy for over 60 years, its a bit disheartening. Thanks for all the participation in this thread. Its been fun for the most part. lots of twists and turns..
C5 relevant
A little OT
Some Corvette history
Some personal taste queues
Some C7 acceptance
Some non acceptance
Some good discussions both ways.
The formula for a good thread.
I am the same way. As long as it's not due to the weather, my Vette and Harley look like they came off the showroom floor and always will.
Safety Car
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 3,937
Likes: 336
A C7 covered in half an inch of mud would stand out in that town 51 weeks a year. They have a car show one week - it might not stand out at that time. That's in the summer though and you were talking about a recent event. Any C7 driving around Bloomsburg recently would stand out, period.
Not necessarily. We see things subjectively. This thread is an example of that. I like the sharp lines and busy look of the C7 and though I liked the C5/C6 when they were first released, they didn't grab me like the C3 and the C7. If we all saw things the same way, we would be driving non descript sedans.
If a person sees dirt first (like me), it's hard to see the car behind it.