Elec. Question.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,699
Likes: 16
From: Sun City- Menifee Calif.
Hmmmmmmmmmm,,,,,,,,, There isnt a GROUND for that circuit (persay)
There is a 5 VDC REFERENCE WIRE and a (LOW REFERENCE ) signal wire. That sensor does NOT connect to ANY GROUND! PERIOD!
If I had to GUESS (I guess pretty good) I woud say that some wires are bare "SOMEWHERE" from the connector to the PCM.
SO,,,,,,, BROTHER,,,, Start at the connector and start UN-TAPEING the harness. You can get the vinal tape at any electrical supply house (HOME DEPOT) and easily retape the harness.
GET HOT!!
There is a 5 VDC REFERENCE WIRE and a (LOW REFERENCE ) signal wire. That sensor does NOT connect to ANY GROUND! PERIOD!
If I had to GUESS (I guess pretty good) I woud say that some wires are bare "SOMEWHERE" from the connector to the PCM.
SO,,,,,,, BROTHER,,,, Start at the connector and start UN-TAPEING the harness. You can get the vinal tape at any electrical supply house (HOME DEPOT) and easily retape the harness.
GET HOT!!
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,699
Likes: 16
From: Sun City- Menifee Calif.
Thank you Bill! Another ? Do the oil temp and coolant temp sensors have a wire in common? It seems that everytime this happens, they are both involved. And another thing, The other day when I could not get a half block without the problems. All I did was disconnect the oil temp sensor, And everything was good, except oil temp read low. No codes then. That was before I put the new Delphi oil temp sensor in and hooked it up Then today happened. I just keep thinking its got to be a simple fix, If I can find it. Maybe look around the oil temp sensor area? Agian, Thanks for the help and patience with this electrical invalid!!
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,699
Likes: 16
From: Sun City- Menifee Calif.
Cleaned MAF today, Went for 20 min. drive Noticible difference on throttle response, and idle smoothness, No electrical issues, every thing normal. 
Earlier, I had my wife watch DIC and gauges while I wiggled every wire and harness under hood, and under car that I could reach, and nothing affected the normal readings on all gauges. D.
Earlier, I had my wife watch DIC and gauges while I wiggled every wire and harness under hood, and under car that I could reach, and nothing affected the normal readings on all gauges. D.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,699
Likes: 16
From: Sun City- Menifee Calif.
[QUOTE=Dennis Wilson;1596805528]Cleaned MAF today, The wires were dark colored, and cleaned up to a bright shiny color. Went for 20 min. drive Noticible difference on throttle response, and idle smoothness, No electrical issues, every thing normal. Earlier, I had my wife watch DIC and gauges while I wiggled every wire and harness under hood, and under car that I could reach, and nothing affected the normal readings on all gauges. D.[/QUOTE
The reason being, that yesterday on FWY. the car had stumbled slightly then ran normal rest of way home Gauges did not change and no codes. I read that symptom could be caused by dirty MAF. It had never been cleaned since I got the car new. Then after hour or so I started to go to get some MAF cleaner and all the crap started again, and limped home with oil temp low.
Earlier, I had my wife watch DIC and gauges while I wiggled every wire and harness under hood, and under car that I could reach, and nothing affected the normal readings on all gauges. D.[/QUOTEThe reason being, that yesterday on FWY. the car had stumbled slightly then ran normal rest of way home Gauges did not change and no codes. I read that symptom could be caused by dirty MAF. It had never been cleaned since I got the car new. Then after hour or so I started to go to get some MAF cleaner and all the crap started again, and limped home with oil temp low.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,699
Likes: 16
From: Sun City- Menifee Calif.
OK Here is the latest on this ongoing drama. After cleaning the MAF which it needed. and noticing a good difference in throttle response, and idle quality, I pulled Alt. and saw where the wire harness had been rubbing on a bolt stud right above the coolant sensor. It had rubbed off some of the protective kind of cloth sleeve . The sensor wires are right in there. So I opened it up and the wires looked good. But taped them up good and kind of relocated the harness so nothing is touching the stud now. Have driven the car twice now, and runs perfect! Maybe 50 miles or so. Might it be possible for the wire to ground intermittently against the stud even if the insulation looks ok? Thanks, D. 
Tech Contributor
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 32,910
Likes: 2,402
From: Anthony TX
CI 6,7,8,9,11 Vet
St. Jude Donor '08
OK Here is the latest on this ongoing drama. After cleaning the MAF which it needed. and noticing a good difference in throttle response, and idle quality, I pulled Alt. and saw where the wire harness had been rubbing on a bolt stud right above the coolant sensor. It had rubbed off some of the protective kind of cloth sleeve . The sensor wires are right in there. So I opened it up and the wires looked good. But taped them up good and kind of relocated the harness so nothing is touching the stud now. Have driven the car twice now, and runs perfect! Maybe 50 miles or so. Might it be possible for the wire to ground intermittently against the stud even if the insulation looks ok? Thanks, D.
Run it for while and see what goes. You may need to do an end to end rsistance check of the two wires if the problem presists.
If it were ME, I would untape the entire harness and look for damage!!
BC
Safety Car
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 4,776
Likes: 142
From: North of Atlanta GA
St. Jude Donor '05
OK Here is the latest on this ongoing drama. After cleaning the MAF which it needed. and noticing a good difference in throttle response, and idle quality, I pulled Alt. and saw where the wire harness had been rubbing on a bolt stud right above the coolant sensor. It had rubbed off some of the protective kind of cloth sleeve . The sensor wires are right in there. So I opened it up and the wires looked good. But taped them up good and kind of relocated the harness so nothing is touching the stud now. Have driven the car twice now, and runs perfect! Maybe 50 miles or so. Might it be possible for the wire to ground intermittently against the stud even if the insulation looks ok? Thanks, D.
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Former Vendor
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 11,792
Likes: 255
From: Ossining New York
St. Jude Donor '07-'08-'09-'10-'12-'13-'14
Hey there Dennis....
Hey there Dennis....
I got your PM and finally found the thread.
It would appear that you've got Bill Curlee on your side and there's no better electrical help you can get for free!
He's your man... Listen to EVERY word he says and ASSUME NOTHING.... Follow his instructions word for word....
I DO.
Chuck CoW
I got your PM and finally found the thread.
It would appear that you've got Bill Curlee on your side and there's no better electrical help you can get for free!
He's your man... Listen to EVERY word he says and ASSUME NOTHING.... Follow his instructions word for word....
I DO.
Chuck CoW
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,699
Likes: 16
From: Sun City- Menifee Calif.
Hey there Dennis....
I got your PM and finally found the thread.
It would appear that you've got Bill Curlee on your side and there's no better electrical help you can get for free!
He's your man... Listen to EVERY word he says and ASSUME NOTHING.... Follow his instructions word for word....
I DO.
Chuck CoW
I got your PM and finally found the thread.
It would appear that you've got Bill Curlee on your side and there's no better electrical help you can get for free!
He's your man... Listen to EVERY word he says and ASSUME NOTHING.... Follow his instructions word for word....
I DO.
Chuck CoW
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,699
Likes: 16
From: Sun City- Menifee Calif.
HOW GOOD DID YOU EXAMINE THE WIRES?? The wire insulation can have a minute flaw in the covering and let in moisture. That can cause the wires to turn GREEN and break inside the insulation.
Run it for while and see what goes. You may need to do an end to end rsistance check of the two wires if the problem presists.
If it were ME, I would untape the entire harness and look for damage!!
BC
Run it for while and see what goes. You may need to do an end to end rsistance check of the two wires if the problem presists.
If it were ME, I would untape the entire harness and look for damage!!
BC
As far as un taping the wire harness , I am an old school wrench turner, and almost completely lost with modern car electronics. and don`t feel comfortable at this point trying to un tape the harness, as I would be afraid of messing up something else. Wondering, if there is a way someone with the right equipment and knowledge can pinpoint where a short, or broken wire might be without having to tear it all open? I have driven the car 3 times now with no problems, But that has happened before, so still not sure. Cleaning the MAF sensor did make a noticible diff. in the running of car. D.
Tech Contributor
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 32,910
Likes: 2,402
From: Anthony TX
CI 6,7,8,9,11 Vet
St. Jude Donor '08
DENNIS 
Its a HARNESS!
Just unwind the OLD vinal tape off the harness. Its NOT difficult and you will NOT hurt anything!!!!
You can get non sticky vinyl tape at Home Depot in the electrical isle.
When you are done, just re wrap the harness with new tape and do little over laps and it will look good as new. Most likely BETTER than it looks now.
Its a HARNESS! Just unwind the OLD vinal tape off the harness. Its NOT difficult and you will NOT hurt anything!!!!You can get non sticky vinyl tape at Home Depot in the electrical isle.
When you are done, just re wrap the harness with new tape and do little over laps and it will look good as new. Most likely BETTER than it looks now.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,699
Likes: 16
From: Sun City- Menifee Calif.
Drove car today, ran perfect! So we`ll see. How ever, When I got home shut off car, pulled key out, The security light kept blinking. and was chiming, and DIC said "pull key wait 10 seconds" Got out, shut door, still chiming, and blinking, got back in started car, shut it off and it stopped. everything ok. I installed CLB couple years ago. after having the column lock up on me. no probs til today.Also, No codes. Maybe just a one time thing, ? Also dealer did the recall in Aug. 2004. D.
D.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,699
Likes: 16
From: Sun City- Menifee Calif.
I have driven the car 4-5 times for short dist.Maybe 100 miles total. No probs since I cleaned the MAF, and played with the wires under the alt. Cleaning the MAF made a noticeble diff. in throttle response and idle. Time will tell.
Last edited by Dennis Wilson; Mar 24, 2018 at 12:46 PM. Reason: forgot something