Torque Management System - C6
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,271
Likes: 182
From: Manassas VA
Originally Posted by dennis50nj
due you agree that i can heat my tires and get them just as hot without a line lock. if you do than how can using one give me a better 60ft it doesnt you are dreaming. a lot of guys use it just like i said so there is no roll up or back out of the beams and some people preload to get a better launch. some people just cant drive
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 11,549
Likes: 27
From: Southampton NJ
Originally Posted by ronsc1985
Did you miss the word consistently? BTW I have a NHRA/IHRA competition license and race on a weekly basis against real racers not dyno queens and test and tune wannabes.
doesnt make me right or you right but i am right you are wrong don't change it to consistency now you said makes 60 ft faster wrong
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 11,549
Likes: 27
From: Southampton NJ
Originally Posted by TMyers
Of course you missed the word speculating. I used that word because I don't know. And of course you know how it all works so please tell us.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,259
Likes: 16
From: Monroe Township New Jersey
St. Jude Donor '05-'06-'07-'08-'09-'10-'11-'12-'13-'14-'15-'16
St. Jude donor in memory of jpee '14
Why are we discussing Line lock/roll control. ?????
Cartek had a 1.5 something sixty foot, the 11.5 et is irrelevant. How did he run that quick at sixty time without invoking TM? In my opinion we will never find out.
Because
We are never going to figure out how TM actually works from the tuners & GM is never going to tell. The tuners make money reducing its effects. If someone on this forum feels his car doesn't have TM than so be it. If there are still individuals who need to see for themselves..... then run a data logger while you run the car down the quarter. I am sure you will see timing being pulled, throttle position reduced & etc.
BTW Just for the record
Roll control on an auto saves the converter neck from ballooning causing damage to the front seal & front pump for those of us who insist on power braking instead of flashing the converter.
Cartek had a 1.5 something sixty foot, the 11.5 et is irrelevant. How did he run that quick at sixty time without invoking TM? In my opinion we will never find out.
Because
We are never going to figure out how TM actually works from the tuners & GM is never going to tell. The tuners make money reducing its effects. If someone on this forum feels his car doesn't have TM than so be it. If there are still individuals who need to see for themselves..... then run a data logger while you run the car down the quarter. I am sure you will see timing being pulled, throttle position reduced & etc.
BTW Just for the record
Roll control on an auto saves the converter neck from ballooning causing damage to the front seal & front pump for those of us who insist on power braking instead of flashing the converter.
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 11,549
Likes: 27
From: Southampton NJ
Originally Posted by Tommy D
Why are we discussing Line lock/roll control. ?????
Cartek had a 1.5 something sixty foot, the 11.5 et is irrelevant. How did he run that quick at sixty time without invoking TM? In my opinion we will never find out.
Because
We are never going to figure out how TM actually works from the tuners & GM is never going to tell. The tuners make money reducing its effects. If someone on this forum feels his car doesn't have TM than so be it. If there are still individuals who need to see for themselves..... then run a data logger while you run the car down the quarter. I am sure you will see timing being pulled, throttle position reduced & etc.
BTW Just for the record
Roll control on an auto saves the converter neck from ballooning causing damage to the front seal & front pump for those of us who insist on power braking instead of flashing the converter.
Cartek had a 1.5 something sixty foot, the 11.5 et is irrelevant. How did he run that quick at sixty time without invoking TM? In my opinion we will never find out.
Because
We are never going to figure out how TM actually works from the tuners & GM is never going to tell. The tuners make money reducing its effects. If someone on this forum feels his car doesn't have TM than so be it. If there are still individuals who need to see for themselves..... then run a data logger while you run the car down the quarter. I am sure you will see timing being pulled, throttle position reduced & etc.
BTW Just for the record
Roll control on an auto saves the converter neck from ballooning causing damage to the front seal & front pump for those of us who insist on power braking instead of flashing the converter.
but that's why they make anti balloon plates
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,259
Likes: 16
From: Monroe Township New Jersey
St. Jude Donor '05-'06-'07-'08-'09-'10-'11-'12-'13-'14-'15-'16
St. Jude donor in memory of jpee '14
Originally Posted by ronsc1985
Did you miss the word consistently? BTW I have a NHRA/IHRA competition license and race on a weekly basis against real racers not dyno queens and test and tune wannabes.
but the rest is not. We are all missing the fact that Cartek ran a very very quick sixty foot when no one else did
Safety Car
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 3,565
Likes: 5
From: stafford country, va. Avatar: Me on turn 3 @ Bristol (The World's Fastest Half-Mile)
Originally Posted by Tommy D
Why are we discussing Line lock/roll control. ?????
Cartek had a 1.5 something sixty foot, the 11.5 et is irrelevant. How did he run that quick at sixty time without invoking TM? In my opinion we will never find out.
Because
We are never going to figure out how TM actually works from the tuners & GM is never going to tell. The tuners make money reducing its effects. If someone on this forum feels his car doesn't have TM than so be it. If there are still individuals who need to see for themselves..... then run a data logger while you run the car down the quarter. I am sure you will see timing being pulled, throttle position reduced & etc.
Because
We are never going to figure out how TM actually works from the tuners & GM is never going to tell. The tuners make money reducing its effects. If someone on this forum feels his car doesn't have TM than so be it. If there are still individuals who need to see for themselves..... then run a data logger while you run the car down the quarter. I am sure you will see timing being pulled, throttle position reduced & etc.
is it possible to get all the data related to the run instead of just info that shows timing and throttle position. if we are able to see what triggers the event, it would help get around it.
i, for one, haven't experienced anything that i would call tm but that doesn't mean it don't exist. if someone has data that shows it's there and we can learn how to drive around it by asking questions and trying to poke holes in a theory, then great. i for one would love to learn how to drive around it, so i never experience it. remember, the truth stands up to examination while incorrect data falls apart.
once we figure it out we will be able to activate it on demand and also drive around it.
Last edited by Zig; Aug 7, 2006 at 07:23 AM.
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Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 7,695
Likes: 51
From: Imperial Beach CA
Not sure if this plays into this but when I first got mine it was, I thought, slower than my C5's. It seems to get stronger every day and now with just turning 50 K on the speedo it's alive and well. Mine never bogged or laid down even from the beginning as long as I had the AH off. I will agree that it didn't seem to have the snap the C5's did till around 10K miles. In fact when I picked the car up I had to drive 2500 miles home and the first tank of gas was only 19 mpg. Each tank got a bit better and the last tank pulling into home it was at 25mpg. Now I'm consistantly 29 to 31 highway and holding.
Pro
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 555
Likes: 25
From: Jefferson County Alabama
Originally Posted by jimman
Not sure if this plays into this but when I first got mine it was, I thought, slower than my C5's. It seems to get stronger every day and now with just turning 50 K on the speedo it's alive and well. Mine never bogged or laid down even from the beginning as long as I had the AH off. I will agree that it didn't seem to have the snap the C5's did till around 10K miles. In fact when I picked the car up I had to drive 2500 miles home and the first tank of gas was only 19 mpg. Each tank got a bit better and the last tank pulling into home it was at 25mpg. Now I'm consistantly 29 to 31 highway and holding.
same impression i have on my 2006; seems a little less pull on initial take off and gas mileage is in mid 20's, not upper and low 30's; i have 2700 miles as of now
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,027
Likes: 6
From: Shiloh Ohio
Originally Posted by dennis50nj
i have found the best way to drive around it is dont floor it quickly on the start
I read a tech paper on TM. It was a generic setup not vehicle specific, tested on a Ford Taurus. Anyway part of the TM system relied on the position of the accelerator to determine at least part of the calculation. Sorry guys I have been looking for the web address for a couple days and I can not find my source for this.
I am going to try the gradual acceleration tomorrow night at the track and see what happens. I know this is the technique my cousin always used driving my C5 and he had better 60's than I could muster. I just have a hard time pushing the gas down gradually when I race.
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 11,549
Likes: 27
From: Southampton NJ
Originally Posted by shurite44
Dennis in seconds give me an estimate on how long it takes you to push the gas to the floor. I need to do it on a count so I can stay consistent.
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 4,026
Likes: 0
From: Renaissance Festival TAZ the Wolfdog (R.I.P.)
Originally Posted by shurite44
What is the source for this info? I don't see a reference to what vehicle it is talking about.
Thanks ahead of time.
Thanks ahead of time.
Try this link:
http://www.alldata.com/
Zig:
Don't know how much of this applies to manual tranny's. The Alldata link may address this.
The "learning" comment is based solely on me and a friend's driving impression over a period of miles and time. I remember mine was extremely aggressive when I first drove it and seemed to get less and less with time. Now, with over 500 lb-ft rearwheel tq, it's non-existent.
Pro
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 593
Likes: 1
Originally Posted by Steve02C5
The copyright indicates Alldata:
Try this link:
http://www.alldata.com/
Zig:
Don't know how much of this applies to manual tranny's. The Alldata link may address this.
The "learning" comment is based solely on me and a friend's driving impression over a period of miles and time. I remember mine was extremely aggressive when I first drove it and seemed to get less and less with time. Now, with over 500 lb-ft rearwheel tq, it's non-existent.
Try this link:
http://www.alldata.com/
Zig:
Don't know how much of this applies to manual tranny's. The Alldata link may address this.
The "learning" comment is based solely on me and a friend's driving impression over a period of miles and time. I remember mine was extremely aggressive when I first drove it and seemed to get less and less with time. Now, with over 500 lb-ft rearwheel tq, it's non-existent.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,259
Likes: 16
From: Monroe Township New Jersey
St. Jude Donor '05-'06-'07-'08-'09-'10-'11-'12-'13-'14-'15-'16
St. Jude donor in memory of jpee '14
Originally Posted by Zig
i, for one, haven't experienced anything that i would call tm but that doesn't mean it don't exist. if someone has data that shows it's there and we can learn how to drive around it by asking questions and trying to poke holes in a theory, then great. i for one would love to learn how to drive around it, so i never experience it. remember, the truth stands up to examination while incorrect data falls apart.
once we figure it out we will be able to activate it on demand and also drive around it.
once we figure it out we will be able to activate it on demand and also drive around it.
I agree I would love to learn how to drive around it and would really like to see for myself what is happening. However, unless someone is willing to "spill the beans" we are going to have to look for it ourselves with a scan tool or data logger.
Tech Contributor
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,094
Likes: 197
From: Colorado Springs, CO
St. Jude Donor '08-'09-'10-'11
Thought I would check in and see if there is any ground gained by either side after almost 500 posts. Anyone even slightly change their mind about the existence of TM?