[QUOTE=chazc6;1573020824]The Bentley Supersports does 0-60 in 3.7 sec at 5000lb. There are some amazing sedans available. The term "sports car" is used so loosely now that it's probably pointless to debate.

 

At the last autocross I went to, an M3 had the best time of the day and the rest of the cars were mostly vettes.

 

Well, I've even seen stock Miatas beat Corvettes on an autocross course as well so autocross results only paint a very small part of the picture. Driver's skill, tires, size/tightness of the course etc are all critical factors there.
Out on an open road course (or drag strip) with equal drivers (or better yet, equal tires) an LS3 C6 still has little too worry about.
And no, I'm not specifying which I feel has better handling or suspension dynamics, I'm merely referring to lap times and speed here.

 

chick car

 

I wouldn't cross shop the CTS-V and M3 or the Vette, just seems to be too many differences, i would rather have all three. The CTS-V Cadzilla is more on the luxtury side and is a great competitor against the M5, Mecedes Benz E63 AMG & Audi RS6. I would actually cross shop the Vette and the Porsche but not an M3. The M3 is unique. It handles remarkable and 8500 RPMS is rare for a production V8 automobile. If i had to choose only one it would be the Vette. You can rule out the M3, but if it were 400-500 lbs lighter it would be my first choice..

 

If the current M3 were 400-500 pounds lighter with no other changes to it's power, suspension (other than spring/shock rates to compensate for the weight loss of course LOL) or price even I, a diehard domestic nameplate vehicle buyer, would have to consider one for sure.

 

I'm selling the E46 M3 and keeping the Vette. I thought about a porsche but i've always had a passion for the V8 sound, i can't do another 6 cylinder, there amazing cars, but nothing beats the sound of a 8 cylinder engine.

 

The M3 and C6 have almost identical times at the Top Gear test track and at the Nurburgring so I'm not sure where you're getting your info also 1/4 mile times are pretty close. You're right about the Miata, it's a great autox weapon. My point was that some vette owners get defensive and think they've got the baddest ride on the road and it's not true. The C6 is just one of many bad machines. It is one of the best looking though.

 

There is an M3 at the autox that is stripped down like that and it is a formidable weapon.

 

Interesting, we have M3s show up at our Corvette club autoXs and they don't fair so well. My daughter is faster in my 18 year old bone stock C4...even beats the trailered in ones. Makes her dad proud!

 

I had an E46 M3 - sold it and bought a vette 10 months ago.

the BMW is a FAR superior car...but the vette has speed / torque that is amazing - actually to the point of being a bit too much to get to the pavement (granted I now have 650 to the wheels, where as my M3 made 276 to wheels - so really you cant compare) but as far as road feel and steering etc... there is a reason that BMW's are considered the ultimate driving machine

 

Nürburgring Times:
C6 Z51 7:59
CTS-V 7:59
M3 E92 8:05

Just saying. And once again, the CTS-V would be my pick over the M3 for just a few thousand $ more. If the M3 is a supercar (which it isn't by any stretch of the imagination), then the CTS-V is a supercar killer. The CTS-V is more pleasurable to drive on the street too with instant torque anywhere...that and the knowledge you're driving an M3 "supercar" killer.

 

An autoX series I use to go to in Gainesville, FL had a BMW 318i and a Chevette in the same class...I loved watching the "far superior" BMW getting its butt kicked by that lowly Chevette everytime. At least he had better road feel and steering.

The average American that has driven a BMW does not consider the BMW to be the "ultimate driving machine". They wonder why the car rides so harshly and why do the tires have to be replaced so often. They wonder why they cost so much to buy and why they break so often. And when they break, they wonder why it's so damn expensive to fix. And you'd think $100K for an M6 would at least get a car free of orange peel in the paint. Same for their super expensive SUV...worst orange peel I've ever seen in any showroom.

I had a car with fantastic feel and feedback through the steering. The reality of "feel" is it's the tires trying to reverse your input. I had times when the tire actually yanked the steering wheel from my hand when I unexpectedly hit something and made the car change course...very disconcerting. I learned to hang on tightly every second I was driving which caused substantial fatigue on a long drive. The feedback through the steering wheel was great when the front tires let go...non-existent when the back tires let go so I had to feel that by the seat of my pants. Now I'm trying to "listen" to two completely different things and try to separate and discern between them. The only thing accomplished was delayed reaction due to processing so much info in my head. For me, you can have your "feel and feedback", I'll go by the seat of my pants and decrease my reaction time. I much prefer telling the hydraulics where to position the front wheels and having them respond as expected, not kickback with a mind of its own. But that's just me...

 

If there is nothing wrong with Mcpherson strut suspension, they would have kept it on the M5. There's no reason a separate shock with the VDM system couldn't have been mounted to the lower control arm while keeping the strut style mechanism. The reality is a strut style suspension has lousy camber curves causing compromises to be made, it is as archaic as leaf springs on a horse and buggy. A double wishbone is the best, glad to see BMW is finally bringing the M5 into the 20th century.

 

owned both, and there is no way I will ever agree, ever, ever ever, that a BMW is the greatest anything. Completly and totally a bought a nd paid for motto, believed by followers, and purpetuated by bought and paid for magazine articals.

forgive the spelling, I phone..lol no spell check..

 

That's your opinion, but the fact remains that it's all over the internet, check it out. The CTS-V is not exactly a M3 killer, when it comes to looks, styling, quality and technology the M3 has it beat, when it comes to cornering and handling the M3 will out perform the CTS-V on the road and the race track with it's remarkable handling. Its only 02-03 tenths quicker in the 1/4 mile. Whats really funny is that you need a supercharged 6.2L cu inches torque monster just to hold off a little 4.0L naturally aspirated M.

 

this is just flat out false..lol the CTS-V has quicker times around ALL tracks when tested, and will flat out destroy a m3 in a straight line.
the M3 is a nice looking car, but the 4 door is NO better looking that the CTS-V.

the Technology, well, more complicated is NOT the answer to everything, unless your German.


the fact is, the CTS-V is the first 4 door car to beat the 8 min mark, on the ring, and if you think this was something BMW would not have done if they could have, your crazy.

 

I stated that it will out perform cornering and handling, i never said it had better track times, and its only 02-03 tenths quicker in the 1/4 mile, thats not exactly destroying.

 

 

I hope I run accross an m3 so I can see how refined and expensive it is and so the rich kid driving it can see my tail lights disappear.
Enough about these German cars already. I'm proud to drive THE American sports car that gives them all fits!