My options for the car are Cayman R, 997.2 Carrera S, C6 grand sport(if the prices really take hit), Alfa romeo 4C.
If C7 feels and drives like a boat, I will buy something nimble and fun. All those other cars except C6 are cheaper than C7 in my country.(lightly used, max 50000km on motor)

 

Are you sure "no one" is doing that? Try this:

The prices are only "ridiculously high" if people refuse to pay them. Are you against free-market principles of supply and demand or something? You make a valid point about the M being a low-volume car. Considering the price (more than the Corvette), we should automatically understand that many people are priced out of this car. And thus the volume comparison isn't exactly apples to apples, especially with discounts and incentives I've mentioned.

When I sit inside of a BMW and notice the thoughtful detailing, the superior design of the seat levers, the obvious attention paid to ***** and switchgear, the way the cupholders are nearly invisible until you need them (and when you do use them, they are positioned for the HVAC vents to keep them cool or warm depending on what you want), the way the vents slats themselves don't look droopy, the way there isn't a gigantic huge slab of plastic on the console, the way the trim can be had with brushed aluminum (or wood, should one choose it, and not obviously fake CF), then what I perceive is reality. There is a difference.
Corvette and Cadillac interiors have been getting much better than before. Do you think it's because they've benchmarked GM/American products, or do you suppose it's because they've benchmarked the Germans?

 

I haven't been in the newest 3er, but the E9x cars seemed fine enough to me.
Underside of the hood unacceptable...yes, because as we all know, drivers spend so much time there. At least they provide proper jacking point supports (where C6 owners have had to take parts from BMWs from the early 90s). Properly real materials on the inside and not the obviously fake screen-printed stuff. Puddle lights to keep your feet dry? You can have that. Ambient lighting to spruce up the interior? You can have that. A level of a la carte customization well and truly beyond even the latest Cadillacs? You can have that. Power folding mirrors? Ditto. A power retractable folding roof? The convertible doesn't come any other way.
At least BMW made it to F1...having won the World Championship in the past, not to mention Le Mans (outright, not just class wins), powering not only prototypes but also none other than the McLaren F1 roadcar and racers, multiple 24 Hours of Nurburgring, even a WRC rally. Many of these were full in-house efforts, not contracted out to, say, Katech types.
But yes, they've pissed away some money there. And on the whole Rover fiasco. Yet here's a key difference: They didn't face bankruptcy and need to ask for a government bailout. They didn't shutter their factories and dealerships. You don't "**** away" that money unless you've got it, and you don't get that money by overcharging. They charge what the market will bear. And the market has voted with its money that the M3 is worth what BMW have been asking for it. When the market disagress, you get turkeys like the 8-Series and 3-Series Compact. Pretty much proof that it isn't all about marketing: No matter what badge is on the car, you still have to supply the kind of product that backs up what you're asking people to pay.

 

Actually a Audi salesperson also alerted me to some of the quirkiness of the 3 series. That particular dealership actually sold both Bimmers and Audis. And we aren't comparing the C6 anymore as we have the C7 to dissect. You do remember that Draexl Maier did do the C6 interior upgrade. The same company that makes BMW interiors. We've discussed that before also so we don't have to go there. Katech hasn't built the C6R motor for quite a few years now. Wixom builds them. And Corvette has dominated Le Mans for the last 12 years now. Smartest race program they ever established. BMW wasted massive amounts of money on F1 and for what. Right now the fastest BMW is the M3 with the M5 and M6 right there also. At Laguna Seca's Motor Trend test the M3 is 9.26 seconds and 1062.763 feet behind the ZR1 after only one lap. At the VIR Car and Driver Lightning Lap Test the M3 is 19.77 seconds and 2308.1475 feet behind the ZR1 again after one lap. Do you want me to continue ? It's just too bad that Bimmer has nothing to battle against the Corvette.

 

BMW sux

 

I agree that BMW has lost it's game but there is no comparable two seater car available. BMW does not make sports cars any more, just GTs and fast sedans.

 

Actually, we don't have the C7 to dissect because nobody on this forum has driven one. There were specific comments about the M3 and the C6, and those were the points I was addressing.
Yes, the BMW is slower. Why belabor the point? It's also less sleek and can't possibly impart the low-slung sports car feel. Yet people still buy it to the point that BMW feels no compunction to lower the prices. Do you honestly think anything more than like .01% of drivers ever spend more than 1% of their time in bone stock road cars on a racetrack? Even BMW M's former director acknowledged that the M3 is seen merely as the aspirational top of the line 3-Series, rather than something even remotely the product of motorsport. They don't give a **** about lap times.
Already discussed Draexlmaier. If you can't tell the difference between an Audi A1 and a Bugatti Veyron, then there's not much more to say. I think you'd have to stare pretty intently through Corvette-tinted glasses to not see the shortcomings I've already discussed (seats, design, build, etc). Even if Draexlmaier did the updated C6 interior, please explain to me how that gap where the center console and the right dash still remains. Or how the fake CF screen print persists. Or how that grainy vinyl/leather on the console persists, only to be banished to the smooth Euro/Japanese type leather on the C7 console. It's pretty obvious that team Corvette were looking to the Europeans for inspiration; they said it as much when stating Audi was the benchmark. Think BMW bought a Corvette to benchmark their interior?
Yeah, Wixom builds the engines now. I wonder why it wasn't the other way around...And they are only class winners. It has been Audi that has been dominating Le Mans outright. And there's a good reason why the Nordschleife is called the Green Hell (and why manufacturers send teams to develop the handling and durability of their cars there, and not to Le Mans).

 

BMW has done a good job creating the image with their customers. As a Corvette person I could care less about the German car. It certainly is not a rival for Corvette for the two seat sports car model. It is a great car if you want a fast four door. Most Corvette people do not track their cars. I am not aware of a BMW club organization as large or as active as Corvette.
My wife would divorce me if I brought home a four door car. LOL

 

You jumped ships to BMW? Hhahha thats funny.

 

That M3 failed to beat the Mustang GT @ some MT test awhile ago.And not to mention it costs over twice as much as the GT....

 

"The BMW Car Club of America (BMW CCA) is an U.S.-based organization of enthusiasts and owners of BMW-made automobiles (including the MINI). Organized into five regions and 67 chapters, the club boasts more than 75,000 active members within the United States, making it the largest BMW owner/enthusiast organization in the world."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_Car_Club_of_America

"...200.000 BMW enthusiasts in about 600 BMW Clubs with all over the world"
http://www.bmwclubs-africa.org.za/ab...tional-council

What's the largest Corvette club in America?

Not at all. I'm merely discussing points of contention. If anything, the C7 will have me jumping into a Corvette someday.
And do you think the Mustang GT is every bit as good of a road car as the M3?

 

Sorry Herr Guibo. My bad

 

"....If anything, the C7 will have me jumping into a Corvette someday."

In some ways, and for some reasons, I hope not.

 

 

Judging by my experience with 335I M3 and M5...I'd say yes.

 

Right on. There isn't any

 

I wont say they suck. But I just dont see the value in their cars. And thats before the sticker shock of how much this costs. I've driven a few to include a late model 3 series, X5 4.4, 650i & M3. And everytime I come away a bit unimpressed. And I'm one of the people who actually cross-shopped a BMW vs MB vs Audi vs Porsche vs Corvette. I had a $40k budget and test drove all of the above vehicles.

It was very apparent after driving all of those vehicles (I literally spent 2 days at CarMax driving cars). That the Corvette was by far the best value. And being able to buy one in great condition.. $10k under my budget made the deal even sweeter.

Now that I've been a Vette owner for two years. Other advantages over its European competition are starting to pay off rewards. 30mpg highway. Removable top. Cheap maintenance. Reliable power-train & electronics. Cheap insurance. And probably the most important part.. a red Corvette looks extremely exotic among a sea of black/silver German vehicles.

Which is very important, to me atleast, because it seems everyone in DC drives a damn black or silver German vehicle. It feels so good NOT to blend in with the crowd.

 

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...n/viewall.html

I would say yes.

It's a Drivers race on willow springs which is hardly what I would consider the smoothest track out there.

Let alone the author got a better time in the Stang than the Bimmer. In a Motor Trend article of all things, who like C&D they have a fetish for BMW.

To only beat a GT by .09 seconds if I were a BMW owner I'd just hang my head in shame and never talk about how amazing the car handles and drives again

Mind you the current stang is completely Bad ***, but still, the BMW is allegedly in a heavier weight class than a pony car.

Given that the Camaro is even quicker than the GT, why would you even buy a BMW for anything but a Nameplate? Why because it ''has an interior''? For the price tag difference alone between the cars, you could put anything you wanted in for an interior upgrade and still have enough room left over to slap a procharger setup on either the stang or camaro.

When you buy a BMW you can now be like a Buick owner. You're buying for comfort not performance

 

It's amusing for me to read this as it reminds me of myself defending my red Italian cars from Maranello to my Porsche friends. They incessantly would bring up the performance advantages of their aero beetles and I would retort the virtues of the stallion. It was so much fun to watch them self implode over their jealousies. One even told me my newly purchased car was ugly. This coming from a Porsche beetle owner. You have got to be kidding me!! Getting back on subject. You seem to downplay the Le Mans class system. This is the very reason Corvette has made such huge improvements in their car. If BMW had done the same they would not be in the position that they are now. And the Green Hell. Who holds the non winged production car record there??? Oh yes, that would be the ZR1 with the ZO6 3.05 seconds behind. I think the BMW does it in a 7:50 to 8:00 time. And they think their cars are the ultimate driving machine. Hilarious !!!!

 

Just curious "skank", why do you say non winged? If you start with that then you can say non supercharged!