My first rebuild
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,868
Likes: 13
From: Mascoutah IL
Rogman used gallons of lacquer thinner and scotch-brite and hundreds of rolls of paper towels along with his Most Excellent Wife to strip the primer off of his '73. I used the somewhat more draconian but environmentally-friendly method of wet-sanding the primer off with 320 grit paper. I then scuffed it lighly with 120 grit paper to give a bit of 'tooth' for the body filler and primer to bite onto. After that I washed the car with Palmolive Oxy-blast dish soap.
I have noticed on these pages that 20 different people can paint a car 20 different ways. The way I did mine worked well for me, but I did benefit quite a bit from the advice of others. Some of it I used, some not. At the end of the day the paint job you put on your car is going to be the result of decisions that you made along the way, and that will be your signature.
Some will get this..."Whatsoever you do, do it heartily, as unto the Lord". If you follow that counsel, you can't go wrong.
If I had to take a guess, they spent a "week" to strip the entire fiberglass body down to bare glass...
Once I started tackling the seams and body work, I "lightly" hit each panel with 80 grit on "some" type of block... Then glassed in the seams, fixed minor imperfections with Evercoat Vette Panel Adhesive, and skim coated entire car with Evercoat Metalglaze (which was a TON of work/blocking)... Then hit with PPG K36 primer before PPG base/clear...
Everyone you ask will do it a little differently as Dave said... Figure out what works best for you and your budget... I would estimate that all my body shop supplies, primer, paint and clear would add up easily to $1.5K to $2K... I have ALL of my receipts for my entire build, but REFUSE to add them up... Don't want to know... BTW, my figure doesn't address buying a SATA spray gun, and a few cheapos that I've used to spray primer and POR15... The is the compressor, and so on and so on...
I'm certainly no pro, but I listen to all advice given and press forward with what I think best... Very happy with my results... The one thing I wish I could've scored was access to a "pro paint booth" for shooting base and clear... Sure that would've made a huge difference...
Good luck, have fun and I'll follow along on the Paint board...
Rogman
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,650
Likes: 2
From: Tulsa Oklahoma
Yepper, could not have imagined using 320 all the way around... As Dave pointed out, we used up a 5-gallon pail of lacquer thinner throughout the strip job... But that includes all paint primer on top of car, plus entire under-carriage, interior, engine compartment, inside doors, underneath of hood and vert hatch... Once you get the flow, the primer actually comes off pretty easy... Plus, I entrusted the Thai Maffia (wife and mother-in-law) to tackle this... They are perfectionists and did a marvelous job...
If I had to take a guess, they spent a "week" to strip the entire fiberglass body down to bare glass...
Once I started tackling the seams and body work, I "lightly" hit each panel with 80 grit on "some" type of block... Then glassed in the seams, fixed minor imperfections with Evercoat Vette Panel Adhesive, and skim coated entire car with Evercoat Metalglaze (which was a TON of work/blocking)... Then hit with PPG K36 primer before PPG base/clear...
Everyone you ask will do it a little differently as Dave said... Figure out what works best for you and your budget... I would estimate that all my body shop supplies, primer, paint and clear would add up easily to $1.5K to $2K... I have ALL of my receipts for my entire build, but REFUSE to add them up... Don't want to know... BTW, my figure doesn't address buying a SATA spray gun, and a few cheapos that I've used to spray primer and POR15... The is the compressor, and so on and so on...
I'm certainly no pro, but I listen to all advice given and press forward with what I think best... Very happy with my results... The one thing I wish I could've scored was access to a "pro paint booth" for shooting base and clear... Sure that would've made a huge difference...
Good luck, have fun and I'll follow along on the Paint board...
Rogman
If I had to take a guess, they spent a "week" to strip the entire fiberglass body down to bare glass...
Once I started tackling the seams and body work, I "lightly" hit each panel with 80 grit on "some" type of block... Then glassed in the seams, fixed minor imperfections with Evercoat Vette Panel Adhesive, and skim coated entire car with Evercoat Metalglaze (which was a TON of work/blocking)... Then hit with PPG K36 primer before PPG base/clear...
Everyone you ask will do it a little differently as Dave said... Figure out what works best for you and your budget... I would estimate that all my body shop supplies, primer, paint and clear would add up easily to $1.5K to $2K... I have ALL of my receipts for my entire build, but REFUSE to add them up... Don't want to know... BTW, my figure doesn't address buying a SATA spray gun, and a few cheapos that I've used to spray primer and POR15... The is the compressor, and so on and so on...
I'm certainly no pro, but I listen to all advice given and press forward with what I think best... Very happy with my results... The one thing I wish I could've scored was access to a "pro paint booth" for shooting base and clear... Sure that would've made a huge difference...
Good luck, have fun and I'll follow along on the Paint board...
Rogman
I used the listen to all and go forward approach on the engine rebuild and came in good shape so that was a great lesson to prepare me for this!
Is your car documented on the forum where I can look?
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,428
Likes: 5
From: Japan
Just as a refresher, Scott, here's what my hood looked like after scraping and stripping the top three layers of paint off...
...Then after about two hours of wetsanding with 320 grit paper. It came out looking as close to raw factory glass as I was ever gonna get it-
And so it went with the rest of the car. Your car has less paint on it, and you're 11 years younger than me, so this will be a piece of cake for you, Grasshopper. What was most amazing to me was that after 15 grueling months of stripping and scraping and sanding and !&**!?* I bondo'd, primed, blocked, basecoated, clearcoated, colorsanded, polished, and assembled the car in 6 short months. From THIS-
To THIS-
In a little over 20 weekends. Believe me, once you've gotten the old paint off the car, and its appearance starts improving every time you work on it, it goes pretty quick
...Then after about two hours of wetsanding with 320 grit paper. It came out looking as close to raw factory glass as I was ever gonna get it-
And so it went with the rest of the car. Your car has less paint on it, and you're 11 years younger than me, so this will be a piece of cake for you, Grasshopper. What was most amazing to me was that after 15 grueling months of stripping and scraping and sanding and !&**!?* I bondo'd, primed, blocked, basecoated, clearcoated, colorsanded, polished, and assembled the car in 6 short months. From THIS-
To THIS-
In a little over 20 weekends. Believe me, once you've gotten the old paint off the car, and its appearance starts improving every time you work on it, it goes pretty quick
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,650
Likes: 2
From: Tulsa Oklahoma
Just as a refresher, Scott, here's what my hood looked like after scraping and stripping the top three layers of paint off...
...Then after about two hours of wetsanding with 320 grit paper. It came out looking as close to raw factory glass as I was ever gonna get it-
And so it went with the rest of the car. Your car has less paint on it, and you're 11 years younger than me, so this will be a piece of cake for you, Grasshopper. What was most amazing to me was that after 15 grueling months of stripping and scraping and sanding and !&**!?* I bondo'd, primed, blocked, basecoated, clearcoated, colorsanded, polished, and assembled the car in 6 short months. From THIS-
To THIS-
In a little over 20 weekends. Believe me, once you've gotten the old paint off the car, and its appearance starts improving every time you work on it, it goes pretty quick
...Then after about two hours of wetsanding with 320 grit paper. It came out looking as close to raw factory glass as I was ever gonna get it-
And so it went with the rest of the car. Your car has less paint on it, and you're 11 years younger than me, so this will be a piece of cake for you, Grasshopper. What was most amazing to me was that after 15 grueling months of stripping and scraping and sanding and !&**!?* I bondo'd, primed, blocked, basecoated, clearcoated, colorsanded, polished, and assembled the car in 6 short months. From THIS-
To THIS-
In a little over 20 weekends. Believe me, once you've gotten the old paint off the car, and its appearance starts improving every time you work on it, it goes pretty quick
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,428
Likes: 5
From: Japan
Keep yer priorities in order there, Bro. BTW, Roger's thread is "'73 Convertible Resto" over in the General section. I really think if Roger wasn't busy defending us he would have his own reality show by now- absolutely amazing, meticulous work.
Happy Easter, all...
Happy Easter, all...
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,970
Likes: 45
From: Cameron Park CA
Pete, these cars don't have gelcoat under the primer. The bodies were made out of a fiberglass material called "SMC" (Sheet molded compound) that is composed of glass fibers and epoxy resin. As a part of the manufacturing process the resin would tend to flow toward the outer surface, leaving a reasonably smooth outer finish.
Pete
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,428
Likes: 5
From: Japan
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Racer
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 354
Likes: 0
I hear ya on that one scottyp..........>
Close-up flash photography can make things look a lot worse than they are. You can still see the cross-hatching through the scoring, and you say you can't catch a fingernail on it, I would be awfully tempted to not even re-ring it. Those bearings look almost new, too, I'd be tempted to re-use them. Key word there is tempted. The smart thing to do would be to take it to a machine shop and let them clean and magnaflux the block. They can also measure the crank for you and tell you what size bearings you need to order, and get some recommendations from them. Or, you could roll the dice! Get some Plasti-gauge, and see what the clearance is on the main bearings. I think most bearings will say what size they are on the back, if you want new ones of the same size. And you still haven't looked at the rod bearings. Who knows what might be going on there! It's looking good so far, though! I'd guess that since the main bearings look so good, you can be reasonably confidant that there hasn't been too much grit flowing through the oiling system. What did the bottom of the lifters look like? Any wear there?
BTW, don't get to thinking I am any kind of expert at all! I have had a hand in re-building maybe a half dozen engines in my whole life (not counting two-strokes, but they are a completely different animal) and they have all been kinda half-assed, (some more than others!)compared to what some of the guys on this forum are used to. Like SBG, for instance. When people start talking about 2500 horsepower engines, it's time for me to leave the room!
You'll probably want to order your rings and bearings as a package. Here's a link to a place that has some hard-to-beat deals:
http://www.northernautoparts.com/Pro...uctModelId=381
Keep the shiny side up!
Scott
BTW, don't get to thinking I am any kind of expert at all! I have had a hand in re-building maybe a half dozen engines in my whole life (not counting two-strokes, but they are a completely different animal) and they have all been kinda half-assed, (some more than others!)compared to what some of the guys on this forum are used to. Like SBG, for instance. When people start talking about 2500 horsepower engines, it's time for me to leave the room!
You'll probably want to order your rings and bearings as a package. Here's a link to a place that has some hard-to-beat deals:
http://www.northernautoparts.com/Pro...uctModelId=381
Keep the shiny side up!
Scott
I got NOTHING on you guys! I'm listening! ONLY!
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,548
Likes: 379
From: Woodinville WA
I'm in the same boat built about maybe 15-20 took me 3 times to get the T/Regal right! and THOUGHT? I was doing good? 1st time blown head gasket so we went o-ringed. 2nd time wiped out hyd flat tappet! 3rd time is a charm! roller cammed broke in and dynoed at 648hp, so far so good? to date about $11,000! later, I don't have!! So yep time for me to leave the room! when we start talking 2000 + hp! I got NOTHING on you guys! I'm listening! ONLY!
I got NOTHING on you guys! I'm listening! ONLY!What brought this up.... why did you use a flat tappet cam?
11k, I know that story really well - I feel for you man, I've been there.
about o-ringing.... this time, we're trying something different - putting in bore liners (reducing the bore size). We can get the hp we need from 25 less cubic inches, and it's so much easier to seal. But you you V-6 guys are nuts, and it's nuts how fast you go...
Last edited by SuperBuickGuy; Mar 29, 2013 at 02:01 AM.
Racer
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 354
Likes: 0
Yes it is F'n nuts! SuperBuick guy...........>
hmmm.... as I somehow got pulled into this conversation about high-hp builds... I'll say this gently - my biggest, most expensive builds and mistakes came from when I tried to make do with something I had. An example, I built a 455 that was destined for a 600 hp build. I didn't put a girdle in the block because conventional wisdom said it wasn't necessary... HA.. Strangely, the 2500 hp build I'm planning actually costs about the same as a stock-block 1000 hp build. Save the crank and block, it has the same rods, same custom pistons - just the block is different... and here's the rub; a Tomahawk block (aluminum 455 from TA performance) costs 6000. It's ready to go when you get it and you can get all the good stuff (e.g. Ford roller bearings for the cam). The stock block, 3500 to prep the block, and that's if everything is good - core shifting on a stock block is a huge problem (makes for thin cylinder walls). Even so, you have a block that's 25% of the Tomahawk - but you'd be amazed at how many people think the aftermarket block is overpriced.
What brought this up.... why did you use a flat tappet cam?
11k, I know that story really well - I feel for you man, I've been there.
about o-ringing.... this time, we're trying something different - putting in bore liners (reducing the bore size). We can get the hp we need from 25 less cubic inches, and it's so much easier to seal. But you you V-6 guys are nuts, and it's nuts how fast you go...
What brought this up.... why did you use a flat tappet cam?
11k, I know that story really well - I feel for you man, I've been there.
about o-ringing.... this time, we're trying something different - putting in bore liners (reducing the bore size). We can get the hp we need from 25 less cubic inches, and it's so much easier to seal. But you you V-6 guys are nuts, and it's nuts how fast you go...
Racer
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 354
Likes: 0
btw SuperBuick..........>
I've read some of your post I think I'm decent but not in your league. I went w/the hyd flat tappet BECAUSE 7 yrs ago told no need for a roller because even the little 231cid V-6 does'nt need high rpm's, shift points about 5600-5800, turbocharged resricted on rpm's. Well we ALL should know by now I hope? the "newer oil" and flat tappets/high spring pressure don't get along. The $$$$$ spent thats including 3 tear downs all parts including a high $ a## D-thurst bearing TE-61. And yep it is amazing what those little V-6's will do! On the main webbing on any Buick 231-455 from my knowledge is the weak point>trying to get too much out of the stock block? And the front cover-suspect. And nope, I'm not on a tell you something, because its the other way around, you can probably school me. I've seen [thankfully not me] A T/Buick blow the crank thru the oil pan-not a pretty sight. I went w/billet mains on the center caps AND stud girdle. Now very low $$ so we turn the boost down. And happily run high 10's @ 21lbs of boost instead of the risky> 26lbs of boost and mid 10's [car will live longer] nothing to prove any more. race-on.......... and I'll be listening>carefully!
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,650
Likes: 2
From: Tulsa Oklahoma
I'm in the same boat built about maybe 15-20 took me 3 times to get the T/Regal right! and THOUGHT? I was doing good? 1st time blown head gasket so we went o-ringed. 2nd time wiped out hyd flat tappet! 3rd time is a charm! roller cammed broke in and dynoed at 648hp, so far so good? to date about $11,000! later, I don't have!! So yep time for me to leave the room! when we start talking 2000 + hp! I got NOTHING on you guys! I'm listening! ONLY!
I got NOTHING on you guys! I'm listening! ONLY!
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,548
Likes: 379
From: Woodinville WA
I've read some of your post I think I'm decent but not in your league. I went w/the hyd flat tappet BECAUSE 7 yrs ago told no need for a roller because even the little 231cid V-6 does'nt need high rpm's, shift points about 5600-5800, turbocharged resricted on rpm's. Well we ALL should know by now I hope? the "newer oil" and flat tappets/high spring pressure don't get along. The $$$$$ spent thats including 3 tear downs all parts including a high $ a## D-thurst bearing TE-61. And yep it is amazing what those little V-6's will do! On the main webbing on any Buick 231-455 from my knowledge is the weak point>trying to get too much out of the stock block? And the front cover-suspect. And nope, I'm not on a tell you something, because its the other way around, you can probably school me. I've seen [thankfully not me] A T/Buick blow the crank thru the oil pan-not a pretty sight. I went w/billet mains on the center caps AND stud girdle. Now very low $$ so we turn the boost down. And happily run high 10's @ 21lbs of boost instead of the risky> 26lbs of boost and mid 10's [car will live longer] nothing to prove any more. race-on.......... and I'll be listening>carefully!
I know this sounds quibbling... but when I talk about the motors we build I use the term "we did ___" because it's no longer just me... most times my qualifications (in light of the others experience and ability) recommends me well for the highly technical tasks of chasing sodas and sweeping the shop.... still, probably the reason I enjoy it so much now is because it's a lot more than just me.
For your eyes only - next up is a 215 stroked to ~ 260 with a custom flat crank.... 10000 rpm and turbos
the older I get the more I subscribe to Chapman's racing philosophy "add lightness"
Last edited by SuperBuickGuy; Mar 30, 2013 at 12:52 AM.
Racer
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 354
Likes: 0
LOL! Super Buick! surely not soda fetching!
Neat build - ragged edge is pretty cool - even when it goes terribly wrong... at least it's not a 302 Ford that zip-strips apart at the cam.
I know this sounds quibbling... but when I talk about the motors we build I use the term "we did ___" because it's no longer just me... most times my qualifications (in light of the others experience and ability) recommends me well for the highly technical tasks of chasing sodas and sweeping the shop.... still, probably the reason I enjoy it so much now is because it's a lot more than just me.
For your eyes only - next up is a 215 stroked to ~ 260 with a custom flat crank.... 10000 rpm and turbos the older I get the more I subscribe to Chapman's racing philosophy "add lightness"
I know this sounds quibbling... but when I talk about the motors we build I use the term "we did ___" because it's no longer just me... most times my qualifications (in light of the others experience and ability) recommends me well for the highly technical tasks of chasing sodas and sweeping the shop.... still, probably the reason I enjoy it so much now is because it's a lot more than just me.
For your eyes only - next up is a 215 stroked to ~ 260 with a custom flat crank.... 10000 rpm and turbos
the older I get the more I subscribe to Chapman's racing philosophy "add lightness"
down! 
btw; I like the "for your eyes only" now I feel like bond, James Bond!
Racer
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 354
Likes: 0
I'm still laughing! to the point of tears! 302 zip-strips.........>
Neat build - ragged edge is pretty cool - even when it goes terribly wrong... at least it's not a 302 Ford that zip-strips apart at the cam.
I know this sounds quibbling... but when I talk about the motors we build I use the term "we did ___" because it's no longer just me... most times my qualifications (in light of the others experience and ability) recommends me well for the highly technical tasks of chasing sodas and sweeping the shop.... still, probably the reason I enjoy it so much now is because it's a lot more than just me.
For your eyes only - next up is a 215 stroked to ~ 260 with a custom flat crank.... 10000 rpm and turbos the older I get the more I subscribe to Chapman's racing philosophy "add lightness"
I know this sounds quibbling... but when I talk about the motors we build I use the term "we did ___" because it's no longer just me... most times my qualifications (in light of the others experience and ability) recommends me well for the highly technical tasks of chasing sodas and sweeping the shop.... still, probably the reason I enjoy it so much now is because it's a lot more than just me.
For your eyes only - next up is a 215 stroked to ~ 260 with a custom flat crank.... 10000 rpm and turbos
the older I get the more I subscribe to Chapman's racing philosophy "add lightness" 
Oh yes maybe thats why I find it easy to get 300rwhp w/SBC street engine? a lot in lightening the rotating assembly? I needed a good laugh! thank you Super Buick!
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,650
Likes: 2
From: Tulsa Oklahoma
Well crap!!! I decided to clean the garage up today from all the sanding dust and wouldn't you know it, the dang car won't stay running. It will start and run for a minute and then die. Ugh!
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,650
Likes: 2
From: Tulsa Oklahoma
I will try the cleaner tomorrow, should I put something in the fuel? It would start and then when it would idle down is when it would die.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,487
Likes: 83
From: Titusville Florida