IMPORTANT ELECTRICAL INFORMATION (Long!)
3rd Gear
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by mowrey96
Can this be hampering an accurate resistance reading at the PCM like the extra length of wire was?
Racer
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 250
Likes: 0
From: Clarksville MD
Originally Posted by e2helper
No, for something like the IAT there is hardly any current draw through the wire and the resistance between 18 ga and 22 ga wire is insignificant.
3rd Gear
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by mowrey96
Keeping in mind that i know nothing about electrical engineering, can you explain why length is relevant and gauge is not?
Thread Starter
Tech Contributor
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 32,910
Likes: 2,402
From: Anthony TX
CI 6,7,8,9,11 Vet
St. Jude Donor '08
Originally Posted by BretCutler
Hey Bill. I posted a while back then you had some discussion with Bill Johnson about my and his issues.
First I have cleaned the engine bay connectors and the two in the rear fender area on the frame.
I had been getting the Service Vehicle Soon DIC readout but figured it was for my hollowed out cats that I did a couple of weeks ago. However today the car did some really evil stuff..
I was on the highway with the cruise set at 72 and the cruise shut off the display read "reduced engine power" and would not allow me to keep going. It died and was coasting to a stop. I turned the key of while rolling and started it back up and got the traction control and abs errors as well as service engine soon and reduced power. I ened up comming to a stop on the side of the highway safely. I tuned the key off and took it out of the ignition before deciding I should try starting it again. It fired and i drove it home with nothing more than the service vehicle soon DIC readout. I spent a few hours tonight on the grounds but had already done all of the ones that i know about.
Any idea where this reduced engine power display comes from? In terms of what ground might cause this?
I am getting low readings on the voltage while driving at 12.8 and when i touch the brakes or the fan comes on I see a drop to as low as 11.5 sometimes. What other info do you need and do you have any idea what is causing this? The only ground that I haven't delt with was the one shown that had been covered in the battery acid. I did have that problem so it may be corroded. However is this one that could cause the problems I am having or is it a ground for the fan or something more trivial?
I am scared to drive the car now but have to because my subaru is appart getting a turbo.
Oh and I broke the passenger stud off tonight to. Then I lost a tool in the front bumper... That was frustrating. I am planning on getting rid of those connectors and soldering a circular connector soon but they are clean now and shouldn't be the problem here..
Thanks for any help and pm me if you want to call me up rather than trying to reply on this. I can write up what worked if i get it fixed with what help you can give me. Thanks,
Bret
Edit: I am not sure but the service vehicle soon readout could be for a pending rear 02 code. That would explain that but still have no idea what the car dying and giving me all of the weird redouts about abs and traction control and reduced engine power would be.. thanks
First I have cleaned the engine bay connectors and the two in the rear fender area on the frame.
I had been getting the Service Vehicle Soon DIC readout but figured it was for my hollowed out cats that I did a couple of weeks ago. However today the car did some really evil stuff..
I was on the highway with the cruise set at 72 and the cruise shut off the display read "reduced engine power" and would not allow me to keep going. It died and was coasting to a stop. I turned the key of while rolling and started it back up and got the traction control and abs errors as well as service engine soon and reduced power. I ened up comming to a stop on the side of the highway safely. I tuned the key off and took it out of the ignition before deciding I should try starting it again. It fired and i drove it home with nothing more than the service vehicle soon DIC readout. I spent a few hours tonight on the grounds but had already done all of the ones that i know about.
Any idea where this reduced engine power display comes from? In terms of what ground might cause this?
I am getting low readings on the voltage while driving at 12.8 and when i touch the brakes or the fan comes on I see a drop to as low as 11.5 sometimes. What other info do you need and do you have any idea what is causing this? The only ground that I haven't delt with was the one shown that had been covered in the battery acid. I did have that problem so it may be corroded. However is this one that could cause the problems I am having or is it a ground for the fan or something more trivial?
I am scared to drive the car now but have to because my subaru is appart getting a turbo.
Oh and I broke the passenger stud off tonight to. Then I lost a tool in the front bumper... That was frustrating. I am planning on getting rid of those connectors and soldering a circular connector soon but they are clean now and shouldn't be the problem here..
Thanks for any help and pm me if you want to call me up rather than trying to reply on this. I can write up what worked if i get it fixed with what help you can give me. Thanks,
Bret
Edit: I am not sure but the service vehicle soon readout could be for a pending rear 02 code. That would explain that but still have no idea what the car dying and giving me all of the weird redouts about abs and traction control and reduced engine power would be.. thanks
Back to your issue. As for the REDUCED ENGINE POWER problem, my 98 c5 had that very same problem!
I, like you was afraid to drive the car very far form home!
My problem turned out to be TWO problems. First problem that was causing the REDUCED ENGINE POWER was a bad Throttle Actuator Control (TAC) module. 97 and early 98 cars had a known bad TAC module that was replaced under a Technical Service Bulliten (TSB). That is not a recall. Once I replaced the tac module, the car no-longer died and had the REDUCED ENGINE POWER problem. If yours has never been replace, call fichtners or Fred Bean Chevy and get one. There about $210 (discount from $400) and a plug abd play install!
Here are some pictures of the module. It is the small black plastic module on the out side of the PCM:
You stated that you had an acid spill problem. Near the passengers side area of the fire wall behind the battey is a ground SPLICE PACK.
It looks just like this:
If it has been exposed to the acid or acid vapors and you remove the end cover, it could look like this:
I would recommend taking a look at that ground splice pack.
Are you still having problems with your Steering Wheel Position Sensor? Clear ALL the DTC codes and give me a read on what the most recient codes are. Make sure to include the H or C sufix.
Bill
Racer
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 250
Likes: 0
From: Clarksville MD
Originally Posted by e2helper
Sorry, both are important from the standpoint of calculating the resistance of the wire. However in this case the resistance of the wire is very small compared to the resistance of the sensor being read. When you look at wiring going to lamps, motors, speakers, etc. - then it can make a lot more difference.
Perhaps my problem is in my connections. I used the type of wire connectors that are crimped when both wires are put into it. (this is what the technician did when the IAT sensor plug was replaced.
Should I solder?
Thread Starter
Tech Contributor
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 32,910
Likes: 2,402
From: Anthony TX
CI 6,7,8,9,11 Vet
St. Jude Donor '08
ALWAYS SOLDER!!!!!!!!! Get some quality heat shrink , slide it on the wire prior to making the connections and you will be able to make the repair look almost as good as new!
BC
BC
Racer
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 289
Likes: 0
Still have Starting Problems. What to check now?
Can someone help me in continuing to troubleshoot my no-start issue?
I have an '00 'Vert MN6 w/ 41k mi. So. CA warm weather / weekender car with H/C, bolt-ons & custom PCM tune, other brake & suspension mods.
Current starting problem:
On 1st turn of the key to start, the engine will start and then immediately die, as if fuel / ignition is being cut off. It takes 2-3 restarts to get the motor to fire & run. This occurs regardless if whether the car is cold or warmed up. Once the engine is running, the car runs normally. On restart, it takes 2-3 cycles to get the motor to run.
1) No Codes.
2) No DIC messages.
3) Column Lock works normally. No CLB installed.
4) Normal Battery / Charging system.
5) Cleaned Pellets on both ignition keys.
6) I have resolved all recent DIC Codes, these only related to a low voltage IAT sensor, which I Replaced.
7) I replaced the ignition switch and reused the OE lock cylinder & OE keys. I did notice that some function returned with the new switch, such as the back up lights flashing when the "lock" button on the fob was pressed. I was hoping that the switch was going to resolve the starting issues.
8) G101 & G102 grounds checked out totally clean, so I stopped there.
9) Checked connection for neutral start switch underneath clutch pedal, but haven't checked voltage yet.
The only other recent change was that I had a new RPS clutch & flywheel + 3.90 gears installed @ A&A. Ever since I got the car back, I've been having the starting issue and initiated the above troubleshooting process, but the problem persists. Since the motor starts up then immediately dies, something is still shutting off fuel / ignition, but after 2-3 restarts it will fire up & run.
Can anyone advise on other things to rule out to resolve this issue?
I have an '00 'Vert MN6 w/ 41k mi. So. CA warm weather / weekender car with H/C, bolt-ons & custom PCM tune, other brake & suspension mods.
Current starting problem:
On 1st turn of the key to start, the engine will start and then immediately die, as if fuel / ignition is being cut off. It takes 2-3 restarts to get the motor to fire & run. This occurs regardless if whether the car is cold or warmed up. Once the engine is running, the car runs normally. On restart, it takes 2-3 cycles to get the motor to run.
1) No Codes.
2) No DIC messages.
3) Column Lock works normally. No CLB installed.
4) Normal Battery / Charging system.
5) Cleaned Pellets on both ignition keys.
6) I have resolved all recent DIC Codes, these only related to a low voltage IAT sensor, which I Replaced.
7) I replaced the ignition switch and reused the OE lock cylinder & OE keys. I did notice that some function returned with the new switch, such as the back up lights flashing when the "lock" button on the fob was pressed. I was hoping that the switch was going to resolve the starting issues.
8) G101 & G102 grounds checked out totally clean, so I stopped there.
9) Checked connection for neutral start switch underneath clutch pedal, but haven't checked voltage yet.
The only other recent change was that I had a new RPS clutch & flywheel + 3.90 gears installed @ A&A. Ever since I got the car back, I've been having the starting issue and initiated the above troubleshooting process, but the problem persists. Since the motor starts up then immediately dies, something is still shutting off fuel / ignition, but after 2-3 restarts it will fire up & run.
Can anyone advise on other things to rule out to resolve this issue?
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Thread Starter
Tech Contributor
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 32,910
Likes: 2,402
From: Anthony TX
CI 6,7,8,9,11 Vet
St. Jude Donor '08
Originally Posted by NVR BRNG
Can someone help me in continuing to troubleshoot my no-start issue?
I have an '00 'Vert MN6 w/ 41k mi. So. CA warm weather / weekender car with H/C, bolt-ons & custom PCM tune, other brake & suspension mods.
Current starting problem:
On 1st turn of the key to start, the engine will start and then immediately die, as if fuel / ignition is being cut off. It takes 2-3 restarts to get the motor to fire & run. This occurs regardless if whether the car is cold or warmed up. Once the engine is running, the car runs normally. On restart, it takes 2-3 cycles to get the motor to run.
1) No Codes.
2) No DIC messages.
3) Column Lock works normally. No CLB installed.
4) Normal Battery / Charging system.
5) Cleaned Pellets on both ignition keys.
6) I have resolved all recent DIC Codes, these only related to a low voltage IAT sensor, which I Replaced.
7) I replaced the ignition switch and reused the OE lock cylinder & OE keys. I did notice that some function returned with the new switch, such as the back up lights flashing when the "lock" button on the fob was pressed. I was hoping that the switch was going to resolve the starting issues.
8) G101 & G102 grounds checked out totally clean, so I stopped there.
9) Checked connection for neutral start switch underneath clutch pedal, but haven't checked voltage yet.
The only other recent change was that I had a new RPS clutch & flywheel + 3.90 gears installed @ A&A. Ever since I got the car back, I've been having the starting issue and initiated the above troubleshooting process, but the problem persists. Since the motor starts up then immediately dies, something is still shutting off fuel / ignition, but after 2-3 restarts it will fire up & run.
Can anyone advise on other things to rule out to resolve this issue?
I have an '00 'Vert MN6 w/ 41k mi. So. CA warm weather / weekender car with H/C, bolt-ons & custom PCM tune, other brake & suspension mods.
Current starting problem:
On 1st turn of the key to start, the engine will start and then immediately die, as if fuel / ignition is being cut off. It takes 2-3 restarts to get the motor to fire & run. This occurs regardless if whether the car is cold or warmed up. Once the engine is running, the car runs normally. On restart, it takes 2-3 cycles to get the motor to run.
1) No Codes.
2) No DIC messages.
3) Column Lock works normally. No CLB installed.
4) Normal Battery / Charging system.
5) Cleaned Pellets on both ignition keys.
6) I have resolved all recent DIC Codes, these only related to a low voltage IAT sensor, which I Replaced.
7) I replaced the ignition switch and reused the OE lock cylinder & OE keys. I did notice that some function returned with the new switch, such as the back up lights flashing when the "lock" button on the fob was pressed. I was hoping that the switch was going to resolve the starting issues.
8) G101 & G102 grounds checked out totally clean, so I stopped there.
9) Checked connection for neutral start switch underneath clutch pedal, but haven't checked voltage yet.
The only other recent change was that I had a new RPS clutch & flywheel + 3.90 gears installed @ A&A. Ever since I got the car back, I've been having the starting issue and initiated the above troubleshooting process, but the problem persists. Since the motor starts up then immediately dies, something is still shutting off fuel / ignition, but after 2-3 restarts it will fire up & run.
Can anyone advise on other things to rule out to resolve this issue?
NVR BRNG
WOW
!! No body can make a bitch about you NOT providing enough information!!!! Good job!!!!There are TWO things that can be shutting off the engine. Fuel and spark. We just need to figure out which one it is.
Turn everything off in the car, IE radio, fan etc.. When you FIRST turn the ignition to the ON position when the engine is COLD, listen real close for the fuel pump run noise. It will be emanating from the rear compartment. It will/should run for approx 3-5 sec and then shut off. It will do this every time you turn the key to the ON position. This sequence charges up the fuel pressure to allow the engine to have good fuel pressure at start up. If you can't hear it, open the fuel cap and listen for it there while some one turns the key to the ON position for you.
My 98 had a problem where this sequence would NOT happen every time and would not start when it failed.
Let me know what you find after this test.
Bill
Last edited by Bill Curlee; May 14, 2006 at 09:11 AM.
Racer
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 289
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by Bill Curlee
NVR BRNG
WOW !! No body can make a bitch about you NOT providing enough information!!!! Good job!!!!
There are TWO things that can be shutting off the engine. Fuel and spark. We just need to figure out which one it is.
Turn everything off in the car, IE radio, fan etc.. When you FIRST turn the ignition to the ON position when the engine is COLD, listen real close for the fuel pump run noise. It will be emanating from the rear compartment. It will/should run for approx 3-5 sec and then shut off. It will do this every time you turn the key to the ON position. This sequence charges up the fuel pressure to allow the engine to have good fuel pressure at start up. If you can't hear it, open the fuel cap and listen for it there while some one turns the key to the ON position for you.
My 98 had a problem where this sequence would NOT happen every time and would not start when it failed.
Let me know what you find after this test.
Bill
WOW
!! No body can make a bitch about you NOT providing enough information!!!! Good job!!!!There are TWO things that can be shutting off the engine. Fuel and spark. We just need to figure out which one it is.
Turn everything off in the car, IE radio, fan etc.. When you FIRST turn the ignition to the ON position when the engine is COLD, listen real close for the fuel pump run noise. It will be emanating from the rear compartment. It will/should run for approx 3-5 sec and then shut off. It will do this every time you turn the key to the ON position. This sequence charges up the fuel pressure to allow the engine to have good fuel pressure at start up. If you can't hear it, open the fuel cap and listen for it there while some one turns the key to the ON position for you.
My 98 had a problem where this sequence would NOT happen every time and would not start when it failed.
Let me know what you find after this test.
Bill
Hi Bill,
Thanks for your reply.
Yes, I can hear the fuel pump charge the system and then shut off.
Should I check the fuel pressure regulator? If so, what should the pressure range be on the gauge?
It seems I DO have fuel, so I've been trying to rule-out the electrical stuff based on your great info on this Forum.
What's next?
Thread Starter
Tech Contributor
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 32,910
Likes: 2,402
From: Anthony TX
CI 6,7,8,9,11 Vet
St. Jude Donor '08
Originally Posted by MLEN1UM
Can someone offer tips for taking apart the ground connectors? I see the 2 clips but have yet to get one apart...
I'm afraid of breaking the plastic.
TIA
I'm afraid of breaking the plastic.
TIA
Yep,,there held in there pretty good,especially if there all corroded!
Pry up on the plastic clip area so that it releases the tang on the male part and at the same time (hope you ambidextrous!!!) pull on the metal tang. Your gong to have to do that for one side then the other until the plastic tang clears the clip. Once you get it apart you will see why it was difficult to separate. You have 12 female pins gripping on the make pins!! Bill
Thread Starter
Tech Contributor
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 32,910
Likes: 2,402
From: Anthony TX
CI 6,7,8,9,11 Vet
St. Jude Donor '08
Originally Posted by NVR BRNG
Hi Bill,
Thanks for your reply.
Yes, I can hear the fuel pump charge the system and then shut off.
Should I check the fuel pressure regulator? If so, what should the pressure range be on the gage?
It seems I DO have fuel, so I've been trying to rule-out the electrical stuff based on your great info on this Forum.
What's next?
Thanks for your reply.
Yes, I can hear the fuel pump charge the system and then shut off.
Should I check the fuel pressure regulator? If so, what should the pressure range be on the gage?
It seems I DO have fuel, so I've been trying to rule-out the electrical stuff based on your great info on this Forum.
What's next?
I'm diggen deep on the next move!!!!Quick question! Are you sure that your not seeing the pull key wait 10 SEC message or the security light flashing when you having the problem??
It sure does seem like the fuel is being cut off! Look closely at the security light and see if it ever flashes when your having the problem.
Bill
Racer
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 289
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by Bill Curlee
If you have a 2000, your fuel pressure regulator (I believe is in the fuel filter. You should have right around 54 psi fuel pressure at the shrader on the drivers side fuel rail.
I'm diggen deep on the next move!!!!Quick question! Are you sure that your not seeing the pull key wait 10 SEC message or the security light flashing when you having the problem??
It sure does seem like the fuel is being cut off! Look closely at the security light and see if it ever flashes when your having the problem.
Bill
I'm diggen deep on the next move!!!!Quick question! Are you sure that your not seeing the pull key wait 10 SEC message or the security light flashing when you having the problem??
It sure does seem like the fuel is being cut off! Look closely at the security light and see if it ever flashes when your having the problem.
Bill
1) I will check the fuel pressure @ the regulator.
2) I had A&A replace my fuel filter @ 40k when they did my H/C set up.
3) FWIW, the motor has '04 Z06 injectors.
4) Definitely NO messages on DIC at all.
5) I've never seen the Security light flash at all. It seems to be functioning normally, as per the Owners Manual.
I thought the Pellets might be an issue, but they are clean and the symptoms occur regardless of the keys I use, main key or spare key.
Thanks!
Racer
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 289
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by NVR BRNG
Thanks for your help.
1) I will check the fuel pressure @ the regulator.
2) I had A&A replace my fuel filter @ 40k when they did my H/C set up.
3) FWIW, the motor has '04 Z06 injectors.
4) Definitely NO messages on DIC at all.
5) I've never seen the Security light flash at all. It seems to be functioning normally, as per the Owners Manual.
I thought the Pellets might be an issue, but they are clean and the symptoms occur regardless of the keys I use, main key or spare key.
Thanks!
1) I will check the fuel pressure @ the regulator.
2) I had A&A replace my fuel filter @ 40k when they did my H/C set up.
3) FWIW, the motor has '04 Z06 injectors.
4) Definitely NO messages on DIC at all.
5) I've never seen the Security light flash at all. It seems to be functioning normally, as per the Owners Manual.
I thought the Pellets might be an issue, but they are clean and the symptoms occur regardless of the keys I use, main key or spare key.
Thanks!
Fuel pressure is OK @ 54psi. I waited about 20 minutes with the ignition on and the gauge connected and the pressure held, so the fuel pressure regulator is fine.
If you have any other recommendations on what to check and rule-out, I'm all
Thanks!
Pro
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 534
Likes: 82
From: Charlotte NC
Update to my original post #216:
All codes were current except the B0-RFA codes beginning with "U".
I figured I would check the wiring to the O2 sensor since it came up with 3 codes, and that was the most serious problem. Sure enough, the headers had melted some of the harness going to the wires, and one of the wires was broke off at the sensor itself. Luckily I had a spare O2 sensor in the garage. I'll have to splice a new connector into the harness.
I'll reset the DTC's and pull the HVAC fuses when I am done with that.
All codes were current except the B0-RFA codes beginning with "U".
I figured I would check the wiring to the O2 sensor since it came up with 3 codes, and that was the most serious problem. Sure enough, the headers had melted some of the harness going to the wires, and one of the wires was broke off at the sensor itself. Luckily I had a spare O2 sensor in the garage. I'll have to splice a new connector into the harness.
I'll reset the DTC's and pull the HVAC fuses when I am done with that.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 6,855
Likes: 2
From: Grovetown GA
Headlight and Dash Light
In my 2002 ZO6 the headlights stay up, they work fine and the dash lights do not.
I was not able to pull any DTC codes (it is very possible I am doing this wrong). I also pulled and looked at all the underhood fuses - 8,9, 10 I believe and they are OK. In the footwell - how do you check the circuit breakers?
Any suggestions greatly appreciated .
jeff
I was not able to pull any DTC codes (it is very possible I am doing this wrong). I also pulled and looked at all the underhood fuses - 8,9, 10 I believe and they are OK. In the footwell - how do you check the circuit breakers?
Any suggestions greatly appreciated
.jeff
Pro
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 534
Likes: 82
From: Charlotte NC
I fixed my O2 sensors by replacing the melted wires. Only codes left are:
99-HVAC
B0332 C - Outside Air Temp sensor short to ground
B0361 C - Left Actuator Feedback Ckt Short to ground
B0441 C - Left Actuator Out of Range
28 TCS
C1286 C - Steering Sensor Bias Malfunction.
For the HVAC codes, I tried pulling fuses 18 and 27 to recalibrate the left actuator, which did not work. When I go to reset the HVAC DTC's, I can hear what I assume is the Left Actuator making some racket, so I'm guessing a stripped gear or something.
After the HVAC is repaired, I'll probe the light blue wire on the Steering sensor to see if it is showing the proper voltage according to wheel location.
99-HVAC
B0332 C - Outside Air Temp sensor short to ground
B0361 C - Left Actuator Feedback Ckt Short to ground
B0441 C - Left Actuator Out of Range
28 TCS
C1286 C - Steering Sensor Bias Malfunction.
For the HVAC codes, I tried pulling fuses 18 and 27 to recalibrate the left actuator, which did not work. When I go to reset the HVAC DTC's, I can hear what I assume is the Left Actuator making some racket, so I'm guessing a stripped gear or something.
After the HVAC is repaired, I'll probe the light blue wire on the Steering sensor to see if it is showing the proper voltage according to wheel location.